Psionics,and why humans should (eventualy) get them

I was browsing the xeno wiki earlier, and noticed under "Psionics" it said that humans cannot get access, even limited, to psionics.

,....

WHY?

I personally found psionics to be one of the best parts of the game. Commanding you troops, enduring mental assault after assault, and then one day unlocking those powers for your self. I remember the first time I turned the power of the mind onto my extraterrestrial foe. I wore a grim smile, watching those little grey B******s run around in panic.

I honestly believe we should, at great difficulty, and cost, to be able to research psionic warfare. I would add the addendum that we only have access to a limited number of the psionic powers, at least not mind control(unless perhaps if you can interrogate a praetor).

Your thoughts folks?

IMO, they've always either felt worthless or game-breakingly good to me, depending on whether it was Apoc or EU/TFTD.

Once you research the psi-lab and the avenger you just need 20 soldiers with lawn chairs and psi amps while you have the psi-weaklings scout for the mind-putty. It was extremely broken in UFO. TFTD's handicap was kind of non-sensical, making MC working only underwater, although from what I understand, Ethereals used MC to make their bodies work. I haven't played much Apocalypse, but it seemed like half the enemies were immune to them anyways.

Most of the aliens in Apoc were immune. Only the ones that carried lootable guns could be MC'd.

I think Chris has mentioned that they won't be in since they often take away tactics and they allow for the aliens to 'cheat' in various ways. By not having them it saves dev time and focuses the game on the combat without adding 'space magic'

To make them worth the average player's time to use, whatever psi powers appear in-game would have to be balance-breakingly powerful, even without the option of mind control. Right now, there's no point in giving me a chance to maybe panic (or really anything else that one might do with psionic powers that isn't mind control) an alien because suppression fire does the same thing but works every time if I'm using the right kind of gun.

I think Chris has mentioned that they won't be in since they often take away tactics and they allow for the aliens to 'cheat' in various ways. By not having them it saves dev time and focuses the game on the combat without adding 'space magic'

Aliens won´t have any psionics? I like the idea of humans having none, underlining the difference between the humans and the invading aliens, but I´d miss the "Oh god" feeling of facing a psionics user.

The aliens will have a selection of psionic powers (from six types) depending on their race and rank I believe.

Humans will not have access to them for the reasons Chris has stated previously.

Personally I agree with him on this one.

They are abilities we can't match which fits in with the style of Xenonauts nicely.

Sounds perfect, thanks for clearing that up.

More good human psionics threads are here (Gazz's post carrying on from the old forums, here, where Chris mentions Anti-Psi gear which I'd absolutely love, and here mroe generally

With Psionics though, they just turned into a chain reaction of you taking control of one alien, find another with that alien, take control of him etc. etc.

Sure, that 'take-away-the-tactics' thing I can get behind.

But the spirit? X-Com has always, always been about making the strength of your enemy your own strength, beating the ETs at their own game, beating the goalkeep into the goal zone with a ball, and then piling a ton of bricks on top of him.

Sure, implementation could be questionable, but the idea is indubitably taking what enemy has, and mastering it, and then giving back twice as much as you receive.

The aliens will have a selection of psionic powers (from six types) depending on their race and rank I believe.

Humans will not have access to them for the reasons Chris has stated previously.

Personally I agree with him on this one.

They are abilities we can't match which fits in with the style of Xenonauts nicely.

Sure, that 'take-away-the-tactics' thing I can get behind.

But the spirit? X-Com has always, always been about making the strength of your enemy your own strength, beating the ETs at their own game, beating the goalkeep into the goal zone with a ball, and then piling a ton of bricks on top of him.

Sure, implementation could be questionable, but the idea is indubitably taking what enemy has, and mastering it, and then giving back twice as much as you receive.

So should our soldiers get genetically modified skin to be as naturally tough as Sebillians and have jump-jets grafted onto their bodies a-la Harridans and also use completely disposable bi-pedal robots?

They do get a jetpack on a shitload of armor, which does pretty much the same thing.

Well, it's not really, is it? An armoured suit isn't the same as having that naturally. Because then an armoured suit would double the value of having that inherant value. However, psionics does remove a key dependancy that almost all other equipment has - the alien. Most other things that engineering can build such as armoured suits with jetpacks are dependant on materials that you can only get from the aliens. Once psionics are researched, beyond the inital investment in whatever equipment is necessary to enable psionics no further investment is necessary because it's all dependant on the human. Once that link between humans and aliens is broken, once humans are as good as aliens without requiring alien resources, that's where the game starts to break.

And Max_Caine knocks it outta the park!

Xenonauts doesn't follow the same path as x-com did either.

Chris has stated that he wants the aliens to maintain superiority rather than be matched or overtaken by the humans.

Part of that is being unable to match their psionic powers.

New weapons, armour, and craft will enable the player to stave off defeat long enough to come up with a way to win without needing to be able to go toe to toe with them.

If you don't then you will eventually be worn down by giant battleships taking away your support and picking off your aircraft.

Exactly how does he mean for humans to win a war if the aliens maintain superiority?

Shepard-style suicide mission?

Exactly how does he mean for humans to win a war if the aliens maintain superiority?

Shepard-style suicide mission?

Commando mission to Cydonia (or whatever the place will be in this game), I'd say. The aliens will be superior in numbers and equipment, but they'll still be vulnerable.

The theme of Xenonauts is "race against time". Conventional warfare will not cut it. If you read any of the lore, the Director of Research comments in several articles "how are we going to win?". There is a final mission. Operation: Endgame (working title). You do the final mission, you win. However, there are certain clues in the research that indicate vulnerabilities that might become important for Op. Endgame.

Yeah military superiority doesn't mean complete invulnerability.

You may not be able to stand toe to toe with the enemy on the battlefield but that doesn't mean you cannot cripple their war machine in other ways.

Supply chain raids?

Would be nice.

Hitting their supply depots in orbit as well as raiding their land bases to slow their ticker increase and give yourself more chance to build up.

I'd appreciate that. Are there supply ships ala xcom they send to their bases?

I'd love that, but wouldn't that also entail adding another tileset? Or would they use the Alien Base one?

GizmoGomez. There are supply ships! Not specifically designed supply ships. The Large classifcation of UFO does duty for that. The only supply ship I ever came across was a Landing Ship. But they look custom built for heavy lifting anway.