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  1. Today
  2. Max_Caine

    New Damage / Armour System

    I like most of this, there's a good framework here for future possibilities, however, just one question regarding Weapon/Armour level. Is it absolute or relative? By that, I mean armour/weapon level currently looks like any bonus is defined at the point of interaction, so a "level 2" weapon that interacts with a "level 4" armour would grant the armour the +2 armour bonuses, whereas a "level 8" weapon interacting with the same "level 4" armour would grant the weapon the +3 weapon bonuses (+3 being the maximum bonus permitted). This means any bonus granted is always relative to the difference between the armour/weapon levels, with a cap regardless of the difference between armour and weapon. Or, are weapons/armour assigned a specific bonus level (0/+1/+2 etc) at creation, and only get that bonus if the level of the weapon/armour beats the opposing level of the armour/weapon? In that case the level is absolute.
  3. Solver

    New Damage / Armour System

    With regards to damage nubmers and locational damage, I don't say this often, but I think the proposal is more complicated than necessary. Unless you go even into more detail with body parts and damage, it might be easier to implement and balance a somewhat simpler system. Keep a small random spread for weapons damage, say max -/+20%, and introduce a critical hit system that works pretty much like they always do in games. Let the critical head be a headshot for double damage. Then, just from that, a few variables would be enough to have significant gameplay variation. Let weapons have a critical hit modifier (for sniper rifles as you mentioned), and let soldier/alien entities have that modifier as well - maybe Androns are less vulnerable to crits, not being biological. Potential enhancements for mods/DLCs then include things like armour modules that affect critical chance (offensively or defensively), soldier perks related to crits, etc. Your current proposal is basically 40% chance of 0.5x damage, 40% chance of 1x damage and 20% chance of 2x damage. I feel like framing it in the context of locational damage, if e.g. the combat text says you were hit in the right arm, would even be actively disappointing - upon seeing such text, my first guess would be that the game has a complex system where each body part works differently (like Fallout), only then to be disappointed that it's simply a damage modifier phrased in different terms. So that's me calling for a simplification for a change. On resistances and armour HP in general, I agree with your post. Hopefully X2 makes good use of resistances - they were technically there in X1, but essentially unused. The weapon / armour level proposal is... confusing. I agree with the end goal as described, but I had to read the section twice to understand how it's supposed to work. Other than being pretty bad names, weapon and armour level sound just like penetration values anyway. What I'm seeing instead is a "penetration" value for weapons and a "hardness" value for armours. You can get the same numbers as you proposed and more flexibility with a simple rule. Armours have hardness, weapons have penetration. For each 1 point of difference between them, damage/suppression effects change as you described, but by 10% (flexibility for mods, etc). You stick to using hardness/penetration values that are a multiple of 3 to get the 30/60/90%. Optionally then introduce a global cap to these values to make sure 90% is the max. It's the same thing essentially, I guess the difference in what I'm saying is, use 10% increments as a base and get your 30% increments by setting the numbers appropriately, and don't use the terms weapon level or armour level.
  4. Yesterday
  5. One of the perennial problems in Xenonauts has been how best to handle damage, armour, and armour penetration. We want a system that is realistic, flexible, generates interesting choices, and is easy to display in the UI and for the player to understand. After quite a lot thinking I've settled on what I feel is the ideal solution. The system listed below is deeper than the one in Xenonauts, but should also be easy to understand and display in the UI. I thought I'd post this up on the forums to get some feedback before we start implementation; I'm pretty sure the idea is solid but it's always good to see if anyone can poke holes in my design or find a new perspective on things. Damage Randomisation vs. Locational Damage: This first change is relatively simple - instead of weapons inflicting a random damage amount somewhere between 50% - 150% of the base weapon damage, hits are now randomly assigned to a specific body part and the damage is modified based on which part is hit. Head: 20% hit chance, 2x damage modifier Body: 40% hit chance, 1x damage modifier Left Arm: 10% hit chance, 0.5x damage modifier Right Arm: 10% hit chance, 0.5x damage modifier Left Leg: 10% hit chance, 0.5x damage modifier Right Leg: 10% hit chance, 0.5x damage modifier The main advantage here is that it's easy to add in locational injuries based on which body part is hit, and in future expansions or DLC we could actually split out armour so it covers specific body parts if we wanted (e.g. maybe a specific helmet reduces the damage modifier if you are shot in the head). Potentially we could give certain weapons like sniper rifles a bonus chance to hit the head (effectively a critical hit) if we wanted, too. Armour HP: In X2 armour currently provides resistances that provide a % reduction to incoming damage, which I don't think works particularly well - as even the best armour doesn't offer 100% resistance, being hit by any weapon will cause damage to the soldier below. This doesn't really make sense; shooting a basic pistol at a soldier wearing a late-game Exosuit shouldn't hurt them. In the new system Armour conceptually works like it does in XCOM - it provides the unit a seperate pool of Armour HP that absorbs damage before the unit takes damage to their own HP. This Armour HP is permanently consumed when it stops damage, so 20 Armour HP is only ever going to prevent 20 incoming damage (i.e. it's only applied once, rather than being applied to every shot that hits the unit). However, unlike XCOM, the "hardness" of the Armour is also a factor. This is reflected in a new characteristic called the "Armour Level" which is explained further below. In general more advanced armour will have a higher Armour Level, whereas heavy armour (i.e. the armour module that increases protection at the cost of extra weight) will boost Armour HP instead. Resistances: Resistances have not been removed from X2 entirely, but they are now used to represent inherent resistances that do not change as a result of penetration and so forth. For example, units with rebreathers or enclosed helmets are immune to gas damage and this is achieved by setting 100% gas resistance. Similarly, certain alien races may have an inherent resistance to particular types of damage (encouraging players to use weapons that might otherwise be sub-optimal). Androns might have a 30% resistance to Kinetic damage, and Wraiths might have a 30% Energy damage resistance. This would also be handled via resistances. (This system can already be used by modders; it's not difficult to add +20% Energy Resistance to a piece or armour or an armour module. The problem is that there's no UI space to display this sort of stuff, but in a mod it's probably fine just to display this stuff on tooltips and research pop-ups.) Weapon Level & Armour Level: The final system is the most important. Both weapons and armour now have a Level, which represents penetrative power for weapons and hardness for armour. They share the name "Level" because they are compared to one another to decide whether some or all of the damage penetrates the armour or is absorbed by it. The lookup table is as follows: Armour +3: -90% damage / suppression Armour +2: -60% damage / suppression Armour +1: -30% damage / suppression Equal: damage treated normally Weapon +1: 30% damage penetrates Weapon +2: 60% damage penetrates Weapon +3: 90% damage penetrates If the Armour level is higher the incoming damage is reduced by a percentage, and sufficiently hard armour is almost impervious to weapons with low penetration. Conversely, if the Weapon level is higher then a percentage of the damage becomes penetrative damage and will bypass the armour while also damaging it (penetrative damage damages both the armour AND the unit underneath). Note that the Weapon Level represents penetrative power and is *not* the same as the weapon tier / family - i.e. a Laser Pistol is likely to have a lower Weapon Level than a Ballistic Sniper despite being a more advanced tier of weapon (but it would likely have a higher Weapon Level than a Ballistic Pistol)! The advantage of this system is that we can model technology progress in a more interesting way. I think the Gun Drone from X1 is a good example; let's say it has Burst Cannon that fires 10 shots that do 12 damage each. If you give this weapon good accuracy but a relatively low Weapon Level, it'll be utterly deadly against unarmoured starting troops. A starting soldier wearing heavy armour might survive a burst but is most likely going to be both injured and suppressed. What's cool is that once you have advanced armour the Gun Drone immediately becomes less threatening. The incoming damage and suppression is reduced even against your lightly-armoured troops, and your heavily-armoured troops might have enough HP / Armour to eat the entire burst at short range and still survive. Soldiers with late-game heavy armour can pretty much ignore the Gun Drone entirely, which I think would make an Exosuit like the X1 Predator feel much more like the walking tank it is intended to be. So, those are the new systems we're planning to implement. What do you guys think?
  6. Some more Geoscape-Missions for the Signal-Uplinks and Proliferations were nice in the next big Beta-Version. That all is still a placeholder atm, but I like it, because it workes.
  7. Yeah, I have read the Alien Fleet Research several Times too in Version 11. I like it as it is, but can understand Chris Problem. What about this Idea: You can´t see the Alien Space Station because she have an special Cloaking Field. She is big, like the Mothership in UFO Extraterestials / UFO2Extraterestials, where the small and medium UFOs from the Alien Invasion Fleet getting started (Probes, Scouts, Destroyers, Harvesters and such). The big UFO´s have the same Cloacking Field (like Carriers, Battleships) like the Space Station. Your Chief-Scientist and all other Helpers can´t see the stations like Chris have wrote in the Alien Fleet Research because the Aliens have the Cloacking Field and can manipulate our Satelites and Obervations so we can´t find them. Like with the Radar-Coverage against the UFO´s which can only be seen with the Reflecting Particels on the Hull. But the Space don´t reflect about the non existing Atmosphere. After we get a special UFO in the middle Gamepart with his Crew (like an Harvester with special Upgrades or an fast Scout / Drone with special Upgrades) we get an Research-Improvement for our Radars and Observations. The Research Improvment will arise of the Alien-Crew-Interrogation, the previous technological Researches from UFO´s, Materials, Autopsies as well as Interrogations (the normal interrogations improves our understanding from the Alien-Language more and more). Oh one more thing. Chris you asked for more Research-Improvements. If you make Interrogations you could get from the Soldiers / Technicans Informations about upgrading your Weapons, Armors, Fighters, Transports etc. and from Scientists / etc. Informations about other Improvments I don´t remember. To get all this Informations and to make the Game much more interessting you have to capture some of the Aliens alive (Caseans-Scientist, Caseans-Technicans, Caseans- / Reptilian-Soldiers etc.). Here some Examples: - Like normal Guns, normal Guns with the light Magnetic-Upgrade, Laser Weapons to Magnetic Weapons on Alien-Tech (which will get the Farmers and all others too). - Like Starting-Fighter with the Modules, Foxtrott with same Modules as an replacement based on researched Basic-Alien-Technology; later we can research a new Fightertype after we get the Informations from the normal Aliens and other important Researches for that. My Opionion about that is the following: - Autopsies: You get the minimum Informations about the Aliens and the Classifications (like it is now) - Probe: Informations about the smallest UFO (like it is now); after segmentation you can research the Alien-Materials (like it is now); all other Objects get into the Storage, because you can´t research them yet (only with later interrogation-Informations) - Scout / Improved Scout: Information about the 2 light improved UFO´s like the Probe (like it is now); after segmentations you get the second and third research (like it is now I think); all other Objects get into the Storage, because you can´t research them yet (only with later interrogation-Informations) - Magnetic Weapons: Information about the first Alien-Weapons and the improvement for our Standard-Weapons (like it is now); with more R & D incl. Interrogations and the Help from the Military Forces and the founding Countrys we are able to build our own Magnetic Weapons which get the second big Breakthrough for Humanity in the Fight against the Alien Threat. - Laser Weapons: They are a complete new Technology for us. With the Help of the Military Forces and the founding Countrys we can handle to get Laser Weapons; they are between the upgraded Standard-Weapons and the much more Powerfull Magnetic Weapons - the R & D-Tree get more improvments. The normal and easy Upgrades / Things to produce we can keep like they are now. The medium to hard improvments we need are only availible if we interrogate Alien-Soldiers and Alien-Specialists. That makes the most sense to capture the Aliens and the cooperation with all founding countrys and their Military Forces gives us the already researched Prototypes for Magnetic and Laser-Technology, Modular-Armor-Technology and whatever else. And for the beginning Tech-Tree we may find something more too, like the Foxtrott which replaces or assist the starting fighter. The Foxtrott is more maneuverable, faster, better secured (because it get improved with already researched Alien-Basic-Tech like the Modular-Armor-Upgrade from the Kevlar-Vest) and have more Range. It has the same Modules like the starting Fighter. Something like that.
  8. Reminds me of the World War novels by Turtledove where the 'race' invade Earth during WW2 under the assumption the Humans were still at Medieval levels of technology, due to the race having a different view on technological progress over time they never expected that Humanity would go from swords and arrows to tanks and machineguns in under 600 or so years.
  9. Alienkiller

    Ufo2 Extraterrestrials

    But the difference is that the Devs from UFO Extraterestials learnd. In the Original and Gold-Version they announced military help in an Military Base or Help from Police in Citys. And what you had? Nothing of both. They get in about 50 %, maybe 60 % of the Announcements, like Civilians in the Terror Missions, a Storyline like in original X-Com with Interrogations and such. But the Main-Things like Policemen / Policewomen in the Citys, military activitys in Military Bases etc. incl. Help from the last Ressistance-People on Earth aren´t included. And the special Armor which is announcend in the Gold Version isn´t there too. Such Things make my very angry. The Game was good in R & D, Interrogations for the Storyline, Basebuilding (1 Main-Base; all others are Secundary-Bases). The Gold-Version with the light B-Man-Modifications or the B-Man-Modification / UNI-Modification for the normal Game-Version gave the Game a good boost in Potential and brought it about to 65 or 70 % of the Potential it have. But the big Negatives were the not integrated and greatly announced Help from Police and / or Military (UFO Shoot-Down in Citys, Military-Bases or the already announced Terror-Missions in both Levels), the same Sequences in Missions, the same Mistake as it were in the Original X-Com Series and Xenonauts 1 on the Geoscapes, as well as the big Story-Ending on Earth. If that announced Things were included and more posibilitys on the Geoscape and Missions integrated the Gamepotential without the 2 Modifications were about 86 %. That Potential were missed very very high. The Devs from UFO Extraterestials have learned from what we can see on the Webpage and Vids. UFO2Extraterestials get the Missing things from UFO Extraterestials and much more. The Communication to the Community and Testers could be better, but the Devs used the 4 Years of Extra-Time to polish, overworking and bugfixing the 2nd Part of UFO Extraterestials with the Feedbacks from their Beta-Testers. We will see the Final Resault on 20. May 2020. Sidnote: The Devs from Goldhawk Interactive are showing the other Devs how Game-Development works correctly. Chris and his Devs announce something and trying to implement it. The best Examples are the helping Hands on Ground-Missions (like the Guards in Harbors, Farmers with Weapons or Police-Officers in Citys). All that is implemented in Xenonauts 1 and 2. If something in Xenonauts 1 or Xenonaust 2 can´t be implemented or has to get Changed about Problems in Interaction (like existing Bases and Base-Missions or Base-Management and Geoscape) then Chris or an other Developer is communicate with us. The best Example is the ATLAS-Base, which looks cool in the announcement on Kickstarter. But it had Interaction Problems, so the Base had to get Changed from the Kickstarter-Announcement-Picture to an very cool Upgraded Base-Buildung / Base Using-System from Xenonauts 1 with nice Extras as an replacement. It´s not perfect until now, but the Replacement is there. And the Devs from Goldhawk didn´t worked on it and said eat or die, they asked the Community and the Beta-Testers after much Tests with Repairs, Fixes and Improvements for the Original ATLAS-Base. The Result of the Voting were that we get the Replacement with very nice Extras. Such an Cooperation in an Alpha- / Beta-Stage is very very rare, esp. the Voting for such things with the full Community here in Forum.
  10. Yeah, the addition of the space station unfortunately came after I'd spent about two weeks writing the plot research, so I'm going to have to rewrite it. But I feel like the game will be stronger for having a focal point. Mild spoilers ahead: the station is (unsurprisingly) the target of the ENDGAME mission, but while it is capable of perodically destroying cities from orbit its main purpose is to serve as a navigation beacon for the incoming fleet. I guess it doesn't entirely make sense that the aliens launch an invasion at all - but initially the aliens were expecting to steamroll Earth, and once the humans have recovered a few UFOs and the aliens realise that the natives aren't going to be pushovers it's too late to stop the humans developing advanced technology (and so the full-scale invasion must continue). This means things escalate faster than the original Xenonauts in the sense that the aliens are clearly visible and clearly hostile from day 1, but that's fine. I'll need to update some of the writing but the game can still be internally consistent with those tweaks.
  11. Heh-heh, right you are! It breaks my immersion to see my squaddies do something that stupid. If anyone is interested, there are a bunch of YouTube videos showing Major Fails of the Javelin anti-tank missile which are pretty funny, and nobody gets hurt--as far as I can tell.
  12. Ah, well, I had two Mars vehicles using laser SMGs--using the ammo and weapons available in the armory--and I almost always use right click for equip and unequip. I'll go back before the base battle and make a point to avoid any dragging in equiping the Mars platforms. Thanks for the info.!
  13. Fritz1776

    Why do we need vehicles?

    You telling me that tracked death ain't grounded? Seriously though, power armor is way more out there than a mere tank.
  14. maxm222

    Research mechanics

    The Rule The Waves approach also sounds interesting, and it addresses the issue of replayability. One of the things that often makes replays of Xcom/Xeno-type games more boring for me (at least, after a couple of completed campaigns) is that I learn which tech advances I need or want, and that aspect of the game loses much of its interest: I know what's coming and tech advances just become a predictable chore. I don't know what the best approach is, but I don't see an obvious way around needing to play-balance any additional tech achievements or complexity, which I believe adds a lot of additional coding and play-testing. No perfect approach, I guess.
  15. Orbital Bombardment from a Narrative perspective Anyone who's completed the Alien Fleet research topic knows that a space station doesn't make sense in the context of the research topic. However, there are 20,000+ Near Earth Objects in varying distances away from the planet. Instead of alien space rays or alien space bombs, the first the world is aware that they're being shot from space is when a Chelyabinsk-esque meteor rams into a mid-sized town or small city. At first there's wild panic and disarray, but then the panic subsides when it's pointed out this is "just an asteroid". Only when it happens again, and again, and again and the closest (hence the easiest to see) NEOs start disappearing from the skies that the horrible realisation that these are being used as weapons sets in. I feel that this would fit better within the narrative construct presented in Alien Space Fleet research.
  16. Last week
  17. The crash logs are saying you were trying to shoot something with an Accelerated SMG, and the ammo was invalid - so presumably you've somehow ended up with the wrong clip in the gun. If the weapon was working fine beforehand then this might be the result of a bug we've fixed in the latest hotfix where the old ammo for a weapon would be left behind if you dragged a weapon out of the Primary Slot rather than using right-click unequip. The next weapon then ends up with the wrong ammo loaded and crashes the game when you try to fire it.
  18. This is hopefully the final hotfix for Beta Build V11, currently only available on the Experimental Branch. Unless we've accidentally added some new critical bugs into the game we'll be pushing this out onto the Stable branch and making it the default build for all users later this week. So it'd be great if you guys could give it a little test! Changelog: Armour modules should no longer unequip after every ground mission. Fixed a random crash at the start of mission caused by the game trying to save while the field of view calculations were still being processed. Fixed a lockup that could occur in a ground combat mission when a human or alien plasma grenade was used. Soldiers equipped with "extra armour" now use the heavy armour model in the ground combat missions. Custom soldiers now display their faces correctly. The Exosuit armour is no longer invisible on the Soldier Equip screen. Fixed a bug that could crash the game if you dragged an item back into the stores on the Soldier Equip screen, rather than using the RMB unequip or drag+drop replace functionality. Gameplay / Balance Changes: The Pegasus advanced dropship has been disabled (we've got a bit of a problem we need to address in the map editor before we can export enough maps with the new dropship in it, so we'll hopefully be re-enabling it when the new maps arrive in V12 or V13). Extra Armour now weighs 20 instead of 5. Please continue to report any bugs you encounter in V11 on our dedicated bug report forums, and please give any thoughts on the game balance in this thread.
  19. Modular weapons probably won't require much more work to implment now because they use a lot of the same code as modular armour. Problem is, I'm not sure weapons benefit anywhere near as much from being modular than armour does (and the UI interaction is going to be a lot more clunky). We'll have another think once we're in Early Access and see if there's a way we can implement it without things getting ridiculously complex. Afraid not, no - there's currently no way to buy access to the game until we launch into Early Access. There's a mailing list you can sign up for here, as we'll be sending out an email when the game goes on sale again: https://goldhawkinteractive.us9.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=fc840addefb2d97f2d4d99c8d&id=57c4ad73dd
  20. I think that the orbital bombardment, should be a card that the aliens play when things are not going to plain. It should the a big stick to force governments to come over to there thinking, and the for the xenonauts to step up to the crease (cricket) to counter.
  21. I don’t mind the ‘dud’ percentage at all, it’s the catastrophic cockups of either firing at the gunners feet or directly into your own troops. Seriously ..........fire, clunk, bugger is a lot more acceptable than fire, bang, new squad needed!
  22. Ruthless Reuban

    [1.65/X.CE V0.35.0] X-Division 1.00 Beta (1.00.11)

    It's normal. Terror ship crashsites contain "bonus spawns", perhaps to give some credit for shooting down craft as it takes some effort vs just raiding terror site. As said on And someone commented earlier that terror ships also carry assault operators, cannot find where. Anyway that is intentional, not bug. Great, enjoy campaign, this really kicks a**.
  23. viik

    Research mechanics

    Just want to share how research is handled in Rule The Waves. In some ways I don’t see it being applicable to Xenonauts type of game but maybe it will give some ideas. In Rule The Waves some percentage of the yearly navy budget is dedicated to research. You as admiral decide on priority of each research discipline, for example: - torpedos - high - submarines - high - AWS - medium - main guns - medium - ship design - high - armor design - low The game normalizes priorities and distributes chances of getting progress in some area. Chances of progress in each discipline are effected by the nations specialties and research progress of other nations. If you are playing with a setting that disabled historical progression of research then you can get into situation where battleships doesn’t become obsolete all the way into 1960 because aircraft handling just sucks. Submarines can be very inefficient if ASW is going way ahead of submarine research. On top of that you can have some degree of asymmetry with the research of other nations. As a result, every campaign goes a bit differently even if you know what you want to prioritize.
  24. >At the minute its implementation reminds me of that Taliban terrorist on YouTube who fired an RPG into the wall right next to him.. Hehe...you probably want to encourage your enemy to use those kind of tactics. In terms of "real life" (whatever that is) usage, a weapon which blows up friendlies even two times out of every 100 would never be used, but in the game environment, the failure rate is way of increasing tension/suspense by introducing random problems for the player. So do we really need more suspense due to weapon failure when we already are unsure of how effective our fire, and that of the aliens, will be? I doubt it, unless we're trying to make things more "realistic," in which case the chance of firing duds would be much more common than catastrophic failure. The only other reason I can see for having any weapon failure (duds or booms) is for balance purposes--like Mars vehicle-based SMGs missing 4 out of 4 shots unless very close to the target.
  25. maxm222

    Research mechanics

    Yeah! Both of those sound good. And: - A "combat" scientist (CS) or engineer (CE) has to accompany a squad to test a new weapon - A CS/CI has to go on a mission to disable alien security measures (locks and mines) - A CS/CI is able to be an interpreter of alien language, allowing him/her to interrogate captured aliens on the battlefield and discover alien resources and deployments for that or future missions.
  26. Do you think that an immediate orbital bombardment works as well as a build up that includes discovery of the alien threat? For example, early missions would be about discovery of the alien threat, possibly that they'd already started to infiltrate some countries. There would be abduction missions. As Xenonauts took care of scouts and abductors, the aliens would launch terror missions, along with their ongoing infiltrations, VIP controls etc. If the terror missions weren't working, even in numbers they would bring out the orbital death rays. Having the orbital death rays right away strikes a different note for me. More of an all out war than a more insidious takeover that escalates. That's not terrible, just different to what I'd expect.
  27. thothkins

    X-com: Apocalypse 2?

    I had always hoped the connections between the companies in Apocalypse could be used across countries in an X-Com game, or Xenonauts. The invasion and your actions would have consequences for each country, that they would then react to or take advantage of.
  28. thothkins

    The (UFO) Witness by Popular Mechanics

    Thanks for that Sheepy, it was an interesting read.
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