steelwarrior Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 yeah totally agree on this one - but there are good mods on nexus which fix those things...just add more aliens - even more HP is strange to me - how did these guys mutate - maybe better armour and weapons early on or just more aliens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kai Honsou Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 The more I play XCOM the more I cant wait for Xenonauts. So many flaws in XCOM are fixed and corrected, and are even the foundation for Xenonauts (methodical gameplay, YOU surprising THEM etc). I really cant wait! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawk66 Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 I've played now XCOM EU a bit. In general I like it, the atmosphere is great and it makes a lot of fun. But in the current state, it cannot be compared with the original...it is too scripted, and more or less nothing procedural generated. So, in the end it is a (very good) fire and forget game and maybe extended via DLCs but this will not change the replay ability problem itself. Maybe this changes if there is a SDK in the future, people can create their own maps etc....but in the end I think it will be very difficult to generate maps with the Unreal engine...although not impossible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashman Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 I have to say I hated the pc UI. I hated the fact buttons switched number depending on character. The powers were cool but I soon realised that I could plan my battle around power cooldowns. The simplified health also meant a quick bit of math and I could.kill the max aliens by firing in a certain pattern. The base looks better than xenonauts but after the wow wore.off it had no purpose. I liked how cover made sense but I hated move n fire but not fire n move, which was retarded. Classes were a great addition, not being able to choose class was a massive fubar. 1 assault 1heavy 2 snipers 2support and I lost no one all campaign. Snipers on overwatch with squad sight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whizard72 Posted November 5, 2012 Share Posted November 5, 2012 Both XCOM: EU and Xenonauts represent a new school and old school of thought on the same thing respectively. There's also UFO:AI which has gotten quite decent with the latest updates. They all have their strengths and weaknesses depending on WHO you ask. I can see really positive things in all of them and I can see things they can improve on in all of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelwarrior Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 I especially disliked the short gameplay which became boring cause there was not mich variet in missions - I did like the council mission s though maybe that can be introduced to Xenonauts? Just put in many different mission and make it a long and satisfying gameplay - really looking forward to! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russonc Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 I can certainly see a few play throughs to try different strategies...the main issue I would have is the scripted parts would get old rather quickly (but you can skip them). The original XCOM had an advantage of being totally "new" the first play through with the excitement of not knowing what would be next or what your current research would lead to...After the first couple of play throughs, it was all about powering through to the end result (and knowing how to get there efficiently). I have played about 40 hrs of XCOM:EU and imagine I will be playing at least 40 more before i take a break (especially if I can't get Xenonauts to load properly..lol) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartan_Marine88 Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 I found the simplification system in EU to be a bit too far, the removal of TU's just felt like they were forcing me to go back to Kindergarten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzles Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 To be honest when I buy the game, I think I'll be playing with the Warspace Extension Mod by default, as by the looks of it, and what I've heard from friends, it fixes a fair number of silly design decisions and makes for a much better game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldershoot Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 I thought the new X-com EU game was great and i enjoyed playing marathon CI. However it made me want to play the original game as it was missing alot of the appeal. One of the best parts of the original and TFTD was the finding and destroying alien bases and defending of Xcom bases. This was a major part of the feel of the original. The process of destroying the alien bases really made you feel like you were taking the fight to the enemy. Even if the act of taking out enemy bases didn't hamper the alien threat. I think its important to keep this aspect. But wouldn't it be good to be able to actually carry out attrition on the aliens in the game. While continuing to the final death blow to the invading force. Allowing players to invest time and resources to hunting down the aliens infrastructure in a way that reduces the aliens in game resources. I think this could add to the replayability of the game, helping each game you play be an individual experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorlom Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 (btw can you rename Xenonaut to something more xcom like y-com, z-com, unknown enemy kickass...?) Don't worry Zynga will sooner or later make a z-com for you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunblinder Posted November 8, 2012 Share Posted November 8, 2012 Played the new XCOM, enjoyed it quite a lot, finished it and have no desire to ever play it again (I aborted one campaign halfway through and the second campaign was like a carbon copy). It was very slick but very much a game on rails. I'm particularly annoyed to see add on content being sold which doesn't really add anything useful - Chris, please don't fall into that trap. I have no issue with paying for real additional content but "additional council missions" is the sort of thing that should be added as a free update. Anyway - still really looking forwards to Xenonauts hitting beta and then being complete. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrimpton Posted November 9, 2012 Share Posted November 9, 2012 It might be because you didn't play on impossible. It's the only difficulty where the game actually gains an entertainment layer.That makes it a little less of a cakewalk, but if you want a more serious challenge, also activate all second wave options, setting SW_MARATHON=1.99f (instead of 2.0f, that's broken). I know, but it's very inconvenient. I have to lean forward, move my hand off the mouse, move it up to the keyboard, put it on the keyboard to find "Y", press it, lean back. 99% of the game is mouse controlled, having to do things with keyboard is just a big interface flaw. Any game that can be controlled entirely with one device should strive to be usable and used with that one device only. what the fk am i reading? a pc user complaining about using keyboard hotkeys? Here's some advice, put your non mouse hand on the keyboard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazz Posted November 9, 2012 Share Posted November 9, 2012 (edited) Or get a "gaming" mouse with more buttons. You can program them in sequence so you have multiple "hotkeys" on the mouse alone. =) I'm particularly annoyed to see add on content being sold which doesn't really add anything useful Well, that will fix itself. No one will buy it. Oh, unless someone disagrees with you about it not adding anything useful. That could be problematic. Edited November 9, 2012 by Gazz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunblinder Posted November 9, 2012 Share Posted November 9, 2012 Oh, unless someone disagrees with you about it not adding anything useful. That could be problematic. Fair point - but it doesn't change the fact that they are selling us things that in the past would have been added to a game as part of a standard update for free. As a counterpoint see Star Citizen - they are committed to adding free new content to the game every week or two. (Assuming I read it correctly). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gam Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 SC is 2 years out... I really hope they deliver what they promised... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunblinder Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 SC is 2 years out... I really hope they deliver what they promised... I thought that a year ago when I paid for the Xenonauts Alpha... looking good so far. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercy Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 (edited) I found XCOM:EU playable only with the Second Wave MOD options right on first try, plus Warspace MOD, plus weapon and armor retexture MODs. In light of Xenonauts - which is for me a hope for a real modern full military tactical XCOM - the Firaxis game's design flaws were only bearable using heavy modifications. The pain is only increased by XCOM:EU's really good environment graphics - with modded soldiers outlook - because this could have been such a good game, but it isn't. Still i'm paying the heavy modded XCOM:EU, because i have done too much UFO Defense playing in the past. If Xenonauts wants to be a really good game, you have to have very attractive looking female soldiers - no fake breasts - like Tandy from Fallout. Xenonaust must have memorable gameplay moments of triumph combined with excellent alien SFX - screams, slurpy sounds, like they were in DOOM 1 and good NPCs making super humorous voice performances once in a while: a scientist ("I hope it will be raining" Westwood C&C series), a black-market merchant ("Hi Tin-Man, whats up?" weapon seller in Origin's Crusader no Remorse), a soldier: "I have a baaad feeling about this" mimicking Han Solo with a creepy voice. And a lot of these + Having the ability to vanquish a number of ALIEN bases is essential. + Must be able to shoot down biggest UFO's eventually, also a surprise would be nice, like custom, story-built, major UFO ships, differring in room and UFO-Commander content. + Demolish, make explode, make collapse, napalm melt structures and aliens, like what that little UFO-Zapper pistol did to enemies in Fallout 1. + UFO ships of a rare, curious sort should send high frequency radio messages to the player Commander: screaming "We will eat you alive!!" + Put something CREEPY into UFO bases in Xenonauts, like humans plus human body parts in glass-walled VATs or still living people and animals being tied into creepy UFO-machines using them as "batteries" + Put unique UFO-BOSSES into rare story-driver Major UFO ships, like larger tentacley things A'la The Thing and like sci-fi horror movies + Put UFO-ULTIMATUM into the game, threats from the aliens arriving via weird Television signals: "Surrender New York by 4th of April or we will attack your base!!!" or like "Give us All Your Milka-Cows, yes the purple Ones Or Else we will steal your interceptor pilots and make sausage from their bodies!!" Edited November 12, 2012 by mercy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gauddlike Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 I disagree with quite a lot of the things you suggest would be required to make Xenonauts be a really good game. I really disagree about super humorous voice acting fitting into the game at all, certainly not making it better. Xenonauts is quite dark and serious, having voices that go off in a different direction from the rest of the game would break it severely for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercy Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 Inserting fitting humor into "quite dark and serious," content is possible. Of course its costly and doesn't have a too big chance to succeed, but if a developer can make his game memorable, to be quoted years after release, that can create a cult-following. Like the OpenXCOM movement, still developed today by a number of people: The whole UFO Defense is rewritten again from scratch in C++ with a load of new features. Voice actors being in the rare good mood, developers having a good time enjoying the recordings: that miraculous synergy of factors where development goes surprisingly well and fast, like in movie shootings, where quality shots are being recorded, because the team had luck finding actors who have an awesome chemistry together, can create a memorable performance. Once, a lead designer and founder of (then) one the biggest development company in my country told us during our visit that they were creating and excellent pitch for a Star-Trek videogame. His colleagues loved to work on the project, everyone had great energy, content was created really fast and well with their newest engine, looked awesome then the publisher decided that they rather wanted a modern warfare-like FPS so that was created instead and turned out mediocre, because the studio had a lot more experience with sci-fi games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazz Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Inserting fitting humor into "quite dark and serious," content is possible. And it may be funny... but only once. Games like this one or XCOM are designed to be played repeatedly. Then funny turns into annoying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a333 Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 And it may be funny... but only once.Games like this one or XCOM are designed to be played repeatedly. Then funny turns into annoying. I'd say the humor is possible in high-replayable games, it's just not THAT kind of humor. The best would be derived from interesting dynamic situations and player's imagination. (Just remembered about X_COM:UD story). Or you will need a ridiculous amounts of content, to avoid repetitions. Well, i'd say that, definitely, but i won't. Anyway, imho, things proposed by mercy either hard to implement, or stand out too much from the general idea to be considered serious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xerkis Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 I downloaded and played (the very short) demo of XCOM: EU on the PS3. It wasn’t enough to tell if I would like it or not. Mainly to see how close it is like the original XCOM. I have been trying to find out more about it before putting down that kind of money and then being disappointed. This has helped me decided. I will put it on my “wish list” if someone wants to get it for me as a gift on the PS3 – that would be cool. But I don’t think I will be buying it myself. I can wait for Xenonauts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thothkins Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 very attractive looking female soldiers The soldiers looking like humans rather than plastic, steroid abusing dolls is a big plus point for Xenonauts. That they are glum in the face of a global invasion gets another big plus point (although some are probably glum form just being in a 1970s cold war. Xenonauts must have memorable gameplay moments of triumph combined with excellent alien SFX The triumphs and tragedies of Xenonauts will be through how you play, just as it was with the original. The ones that stay with you are the ones that aren't forced. Distinctive sounds for your foes and their weapons would be nice and is in Xenonauts. good NPCs making super humorous voice performances once in a while: a scientist ("I hope it will be raining" Westwood C&C series), a black-market merchant ("Hi Tin-Man, whats up?" weapon seller in Origin's Crusader no Remorse), I want to get to the point of a screen, then move on to other things. Listening for the 100th time to the same, poorly scripted/voiced content will be irritating and wastes time. + Having the ability to vanquish a number of ALIEN bases is essential. I imagine that some will like these best and some won't a good balance of missions across the board would be good for all. I like my alien base assaults. But I like my crash retrievals, base defences and shopping in the terror missions just as much. + Must be able to shoot down biggest UFO's eventually, also a surprise would be nice, like custom, story-built, major UFO ships, differing in room and UFO-Commander content. Chris has said that the biggest ones can get shot down, but you'll rapidly run out of ammo to do it continually. Surprises are interesting, but whether they are nice surprises with replay value may vary. Some variation in ship layout? Not sure if this is going to happen. It didn't in the original as the Cydonian Fitters Union threatened strike action. + Demolish, make explode, make collapse, napalm melt structures and aliens, like what that little UFO-Zapper pistol did to enemies in Fallout 1. Destructible tiles are good. Not sure there will be lots of variations on it for tiles to reflect what they were hit with though. Nice touches, but not terribly vital. + UFO ships of a rare, curious sort should send high frequency radio messages to the player Commander: screaming "We will eat you alive!!" UFOs of a rare, curious sort should send high frequency radio messages to the player commander showing daytime TV, which is surely the bigger threat. + Put something CREEPY into UFO bases in Xenonauts, like humans plus human body parts in glass-walled VATs or still living people and animals being tied into creepy UFO-machines using them as "batteries" UFO artefacts were a great little storyline in UFO, and I'd really like to see this added, if only visually into Xenonauts. + Put unique UFO-BOSSES into rare story-driver Major UFO ships, like larger tentacley things A'la The Thing and like sci-fi horror movies I'm not adverse to there being a spread of creatures in the game, some you see more frequently than others. UFO was more a case of getting to interrogate specific ranks, rather than taking down Boss Muton. There's a risk of railroading if it all has to go through boss types. There's also that at this stage, it's not terribly likely that lot's of new aliens are going to appear. A couple of surprises would be nice though. Put UFO-ULTIMATUM into the game, threats from the aliens arriving via weird Television signals: "Surrender New York by 4th of April or we will attack your base!!!" Mission types discussed here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterwolves Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 One of the most annoying things I have found (apart from game destroying bugs) is the changing UI. As in: the shortcut keys changing for different soldiers, and right clicking being cancel for almost everything, except for movement. I have sometimes sent super-soldiers to their deaths, simply because I was thinking about doing something, then right clicked to cancel it, only to discover I had decided to move one of my dudes. The game on rails thing, is pretty bad too. I do like the soldier upgrades, but found I would always pick the same ones. Not a bad game, but not much desire to replay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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