Weapons?

[Hosi]

are the basic weapons going to stay unlimited supply?

also what about alien weapons? well we be able to use them/reverse engineer them???

Is any of that even implemented yet? I haven't been able to get past the first month or 2 without a CTD and i forget to save

[Gorlom]

The basic human weapons are intended to stay unlimited yes. (this could ofc change in beta if Goldhawk deems it would be more fun to micromanage and buy the human tech equipment)

We are already able to research laser weapons based on the alien plasma weapons. We will later on be able to research and manufacture human plasma weapons and a fourth unknown tier.

Alien plasma weapons can be picked up and used in the battle field after you have researched them. However there is a substantial accuracy penalty to use them due to ergonomics of the weapons. We do not get to keep them after the mission is over to use in later missions. Or even reproduce alien plasma weapons.

Edited June 22, 2012 by Gorlom

[Max_Caine]

Yeah, Chris has stated that humans will never get to "carry over" alien weapons. They get sold at the end of the mission. The intention is for the alien weapon to be (barely) usable if a Xenonaut needs to use it in-mission, but if we want our own plasma guns, we have to design them ourselves. (And we will!)

[spinaljack]

In x-com you would just equip everyone with the heavy alien gun and never manufacture human weapons because it's just so much simpler and cheaper and you find so many of them. Chris wanted to make research and manufacturing relevant.

[Kaguya]

In x-com you would just equip everyone with the heavy alien gun and never manufacture human weapons because it's just so much simpler and cheaper and you find so many of them. Chris wanted to make research and manufacturing relevant.

X-COM didn't even have researchable human weapons beyond the Laser weapons, which you could research without even seeing a single alien. And it was completely outclassed by the plasma weapons the moment you got them researched.

Nothing to do with simple or cheap, they just were garbage in comparison (aside from infinite ammo on lasers)

Edited June 22, 2012 by Kaguya

[spinaljack]

You could manufacture alien toxin in the 3rd game.

Manufacturing guns just falls into place with the rest of the game as you have to manufacture everything else.

[Swe_Racoon]

You can manufacture laser weapons by reverse engineering plasma weaponry, and the game files show quiet a few interesting tiers as well. I personally don't mind ballistic weapons being unlimited, because they are pretty worthless (try taking down a Sebillian with a pistol, you'll get the much-coveted Racoon Stamp of Approval if you succeed). Besides, I'm in on the whole idea that the world's nations would provide stockpiled guns for Xenonauts (being the best and last hope and all).

Actually, Xenonauts approach is much better than X-COM, IMO, where you could just skip the laser guns and go straight for plasma, and then have the best guns in the game.

[Oktober]

try taking down a Sebillian with a pistol, you'll get the much-coveted Racoon Stamp of Approval if you succeed

Ah ha ha ha I've been trying this! I've found myself attempting to finish off Sibillians wounded by sniper rifle fire, grenades, machine gun fire...and even though they should be mostly dead, and even though I manage to pump 4 pistol rounds into them, they never die!

[Hosi]

You guys are crazy, lasers were boss in X-Com, no ammo, low TU cost, fairly accurate.

[Max_Caine]

If lasers were boss, then they were a mid-level boss in comparison to the final-form end-boss that was the Heavy Plasma. Which you could research almost straight away if you played on anything above normal.

[Hosi]

I only used 2-4 heavy plasma everyone else had lasers. that way i never ran out of ammo

also laser cannons are how you fund yourself when the world turns their back on you

[raziel1981]

the true boss of x-com were the fusion bombs...seriously guys...

[Max_Caine]

You're right raziel... the blaster bomb was the hidden second-play true-form boss. It was quite literally the bomb. Hosi, I found I didn't run out of ammo as all those snakemen and floaters just gave me the ammo out of their guns! Can you believe it?! They were so cool about it. It was like, "yeah, I don't need this, I'm bleeding to death here. You take it, dude."

[Hosi]

no, those were stupid, they had magic homing powers

[ThoseDeafMutes]

Besides, I'm in on the whole idea that the world's nations would provide stockpiled guns for Xenonauts (being the best and last hope and all).

Best not to draw attention to this kind of reasoning though, let people start to question why the planet is so stingy with financial commitments given the circumstances.

[Fedr]

I am glad to hear you don't have to rely on Alien weapons to be capable of fighting them, playing X-Com I feel like a "Human Nationalist", I guess that makes me a racist. But I like using stuff made by Humans. In X-Com I tried to use alot of conventional weapons. I am loving the game I just bought it.

[Commissar Pancakes]

try taking down a Sebillian with a pistol, you'll get the much-coveted Racoon Stamp of Approval if you succeed

Already done. Only reason why I was able to do this was because I had already weakened the damned thing with an HE rocket and didn't have time to reload.

This was AFTER another one of my solders unloaded his M16 on the damned thing, with only one hit.

[Xcom Veteran]

Grenade launcher will be available to buy? I think it should. And heavy machine gun .

[Gorlom]

Nope, grenade launcher will not be in the official release. It might appear in a mod if someone figures out how. the grenade launcher isn't different enough from roles filled by the rocket launcher or the regular grenades to really warrant it.

[Xcom Veteran]

Nope, grenade launcher will not be in the official release. It might appear in a mod if someone figures out how. the grenade launcher isn't different enough from roles filled by the rocket launcher or the regular grenades to really warrant it.

Maybe isn't different but it have very nice shooting effect.

[xcorps]

If lasers were boss, then they were a mid-level boss in comparison to the final-form end-boss that was the Heavy Plasma. Which you could research almost straight away if you played on anything above normal.

I thought this was the case for a long time. Then I read something in a forum that convinced me to equip laser rifles on most of my squad. In a squad of 12, I broke down into 3 teams of 4. Each team had a load out of: 1 plas pistol 2 laser rifle 1 heavy plas with lots of grenades and HE. I kept the laser rifles in motion, reserving autoshot and kept the heavy in overwatch reserving aimed. The plas pistol carriers would scout with no reserve but not moving more than half their TU. Any time I saw something, I would smoke it, retreat the scout and concentrate all my laser fire on it. I reserved the heavy plas for sniping hard targets or quickly opening a route through a wall or bush. Lots of frags and smoke get tossed. The laser rifle is more accurate and puts out a lot more shots than heavy plas without the need to reload or worry about unloading a partial mag at the end of a mission. The 3 heavy plas are more than enough for disks, muts, and reapers. The advantage goes to laser rifles because of the accuracy and rate of fire on snakes, ethereals, and celatids. Also, your squaddies gain accuracy much faster. I'll spend 3 or 4 turns spamming laser fire at cover where I know an alien is camping until the cover is all gone and my scouts can get a frag in. Another plus is in the late game when ethereals are spamming mind control on your rookies. If they are all armed with lasers, your vets in Power Armor/Suits are much less likely to get taken out.

End result: Missions are cleared more quickly, fewer casualties, faster squaddie growth, and increased income (selling excess heavy plas).

[thothkins]

I pretty much went with laser rifles, particularly once I had some Psi capable soldiers. Early on I'd have Heavy Plasma on a couple of troops for the reasons xcorps gives above. I just reaped in the cash. Heavy Plasma for the Cydonia mission though.

[TrashMan]

"Best Weapon" depends purely on what you're looking for AT THATGIVEN MOMENT.

Plasma might be the most damaging weapon out there. BUuuuuuuut. It takes Elyrium to make. It takes elyrium to make ammo. And you require elyrium to research/make other stuff.

Also it takes a lot time to make. And maybe you don't have time. 5 laser rifles or 1 plasma rifle?

A laser rifle or a conventional weapon might be better suited for the current mission.

It takes more than damage to determine the best weapon for the job.

Other things to consider:

- effective range (and damage falloff with distance)

- accuracy

- rate of fire

- clip size

- weapon mass

- production requirements

- type of damage

Let's - for example - say that you can have your machinegun fed by a chain backpack. Meaning if you take 4 ammo clips of 100 bullets, you have 400 bullets, no reload.

Not having ot reload and being able to provide continous supression has a value on it's own. Contrast it with the plasma rifle with a 5 shot clip.

[HWP]

Plasma might be the most damaging weapon out there. BUuuuuuuut. It takes Elyrium to make. It takes elyrium to make ammo.

Not really, you collect about 10x the amount of plasma weapons and ammo that you need.

Be it in UFO original or EU.

[Max_Caine]

Trashman, what plasma rifle with a five shot clip? In EU original you didn't need to make plasma guns or the ammo for them. The bad guys obligingly provided you with both for free as you looted them from their still smoking corpses. Anyone that had to make ammo for plasma was doing something monstrously wrong.

xcorps, I have to disagree that the laser rifle is more accurate than the H-P. I didn't find a comparable degree in difference in accuracy or rate of fire between either weapon when playing, and since anecdotal evidence is unsufficent, statistically, the H-P is as accurate as the L-R and only slightly more costly to shoot (source: ufopedia.org weapon summaries). What I did find a difference in was training up rookies, recovering from mistakes and enemy psi. A psi-controlled H-P squaddie was death to his mates. A L-R would ping off the armour. In my squads, experienced squaddies with high psi defence got H-P. Everyone else got L-Rs.