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Thread: Suppression Mechanics

  1. #171
    Gorlom you math is correct.

    I started reading the suppression mechanics threads and was thinking of adding my 2 cents, but the thread so long I read some of it. So excuse me is what I'm suggesting is already been covered. Suppression fire is as much reactive as it is proactive, and assault rifles are capable of suppression fire as well as machine guns. Three shot burst on a assault rifle is for suppression fire in game that could translate into single shot being higher damage low suppression, while burst fire high suppression lower damage. Machine guns with controlled bursts would be lower suppression higher damage while full auto would be high suppression lower damage. As far as the suppression fire goes I also think there should be a suppression mode for reactions. Basically if a soldier is intended on doing suppression fire as a reaction to an alien(or vice versa) poking his head from cover or concealment a mode should she be toggled. Reaction shots while in the mode would be at a reduced AP and a reduced accuracy to balance each other and to throw more bullets down range. This would help to give the feel of suppression fire.

  2. #172
    WishfullThinker Gorlom's Avatar
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    You talk about high and low damage. Are you saying the hits would deal different amount of damage based on what mode you select while shooting? As opposed to your chance to hit being based on the firing mode I mean.

    I think variable damage per shot would make it a different game from what it is and what X-com was. I don't think I find that idea very appealing.

  3. #173
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    Like I read some of the beginning of the thread but skimmed over a few parts here and there on it, so I may be talking about a point that is no longer in question or a concern in the suppression mechanics. People were initially talking about having a suppression shield for suppression and having machine guns do less damage and more suppression while other weapons doing normal damage with little or no suppression. That over looks the fact that machine guns can still be very accurate on point targets with controlled bursts and the fact that assault rifles using burst fire work more like machine guns for suppression. I'm not sure if that is still the current concept of suppression. To clarify what I was saying is suppression fire would have a reduced damage but higher suppression while single shot or controlled bursts on machine guns would have normal (higher) damage and lower suppression. Example: a SAW firing a single round (yes you can squeeze out a single round although its usually done in 2 - 5 shot bursts) is technically the same thing as a 16 firing off a single round, they both have the same muzzle velocity and mass.

  4. #174
    WishfullThinker Gorlom's Avatar
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    I'm still not sure whether you are talking about damage per shot or overall damage moderated by accuracy.
    IE if you fire 10 single shots they each have 60% chance to hit while if you fire 10 shots in burst mode they each have 20% chance to hit. If the bullets do the same damage independent on firing mode, the single shots will by average deal more damage since more of them will hit.

  5. #175
    Moderator Gauddlike's Avatar
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    It just seems easier to have every individual bullet add the same amount of suppression to the unit under fire.
    The damage of individual shots would also not need to vary.
    That way the suppression potential of a weapon would be set by the amount of shots it could fire, its accuracy at the specific range you are firing, and the amount of AP per bullet of its current shot type.

    For example a precision rifle would always be a good choice for damage but would generate little suppression due to its high AP per shot.
    However at long range, because of its accuracy, it would actually be a good choice as other weapons would be less likely to get a bullet close to a target so would be less effective.
    Machine guns can throw a lot of bullets around so could more easily suppress an enemy at most ranges but will suffer accuracy penalties on moving so for mobile troopers the assault rifle on burst would be better for suppression and damage.

    Remember though that suppression used in this way is a by product of attempting to damage an enemy rather than a goal in its own right.
    It is not a separate mode it is just an effect on the unit of having bullets flying past its head/other sensory appendage.
    Devil's Advocate and forum moderator

  6. #176
    Commander TrashMan's Avatar
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    You could also have a different fire more altogether. Supression after all, is intended to keep the opponent pinned. It's different from an aimed shot or even a regular burst in a way. Youre not so muhc trying to hit an enemy, as your'e trying to keep it from moving, by shooting at the places where he would pop up.

  7. #177
    Xeno Lover IceVamp's Avatar
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    You could, but that would mean shooting and missing isn't providing suppression. Which I would find odd. If every bullet has a suppression value, you're always shooting to hit the target. If you hit, great! If you don't at least he's a bit more suppressed now, if you weren't way off.
    I would if I could, but I can't, so I won't.

  8. #178
    Beloved Leader Chris's Avatar
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    There's a new thread on Suppression mechanics in the forum. Please move discussion there!
    Chris England - Xenonauts Project Lead
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  9. #179
    When i find the new thread ill move this post there, or can someone drop a link in here? : )


    now...JFYI

    50 cals kill anything within a few feet of the round as it pass's, the shock wave kills you.
    So
    50 cal can be used for recon by fire...but will kill any civilians/aliens near bullet path (for code speak lets say it does 20% dmg to everything with in 1 square of the round location...meaning if it pass's by you it should tag you 2 or 3 times until its not in a adjacent square any more)

    SAWs Squad automatic weapons aka machine guns could be set up to suppress in the following way

    You right click to suppress and "shoot" the target area...the suppress "target" will be a oval displayed on the map pointing twards the SAW gunner like so


    .............................................ooo
    ........................................o......... ...o
    saw..............................o...Suppression.. .o
    ........................................o......... ...o
    .............................................ooo

    Area being 5-7 tiles wide
    7-10 tiles long

    In military terms this is the "beating zone" the general area the bullets impact

    Anything that fires, throws stands/kneels...or moves in this area is subject to 10% to 30% SAW damage per act Plus aim/throw/moral penalties of 40%

    Further if you have no cover you take another 50% saw dmg

    This uses up a 50round Saw mag every time you do it so you cant abuse it and costs the standard burst AP for the saw (which is unrealistically high right now...
    burst on a saw should cost 5% more AP then burst on a assault riffle (M16) as you simple fire a few more rounds...usually 5-7 instead of 3

    You only get snapshot and burst with a saw as well unless taking a knee or prone...only then can you fire aimed
    snap shot and aimed should fire 3 rounds on the saw
    taking a knee should give +30% aim to weapons
    Prone if you put it in should give +50% aim to weapons (to shoot standing really nerfs your aim IRL...sorta like what you see in game as it stand....it is fairly close to right as is)

    IRL we have 200 round drums and could maintain this for 4 "turns" instead of one
    But you guys don't have saw drums on your machine guns for some reason : / maybe a research upgrade for SAW like weapons?

    NOTE....anyone or thing aliens/civilians/your troops who walk into the zone are effected the exact same way
    SECOND NOTE if a oval is to hard make it a circle, it will be close enough
    Last edited by Chollirem; 12-31-2012 at 21:02.

  10. #180
    Commander thothkins's Avatar
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