Side effect of %-based system (no fixed numbers for shots)

I apologize for starting new thread, but old one got closed just before I commited by post and there are no relevant thread yet.

Though I dislike %-based system, it's better balance wise I must admit. Only real problem I have with it, is how hard to predict number of TUs you need to shoot, in comparison with old system. I consider it as very important problem, which got little attention yet, unfortunately.

Reserving isn't good enough substitute, because it doesn't take into account possible need to turn and/or crouch, and can track only one type of shots. In old system you can easily see how far you can move and still be able to perform aimed shot or move further and do snap shot, for example. Now you need to constantly check how much TUs required for specific shot and do it again for every soldier. This is tedious task at best and can lead to a lot of frustration when you end up with single TU short which effectively ruins all you plans.

No problem setting up a new thread. Yes, you're right - we do need to update the UI a bit to make the new system easier to use.

Do people have suggestions? Aaron mentioned we could put little markers on a soldier's green movement path to show the point at which they would not have enough TU to perform burst fire, aimed shot, snap shot etc. Anything else?

Personally, I need 3 bits of information: what kind of shot soldier can perform, how much TU it need and how much TU soldier will left at this tile (before shooting). If you can put all that info on last tile where shot still possible I will be happy. May by way too cluttered though.

Very rough picture to illustrate how it may looks:

I think we'd probably use the symbols you have in red, but not use the numbers. Or maybe the symbol, plus a number that suggests how many TU the soldier would have if they moved to that tile and used that shot - i.e. the number would represent how many TU you have for turning.

So it might show a burst fire symbol with a 2 next to it. That means that if a soldier moved to that tile, they'd be able to spend 2 TU rotating and still be able to burst fire. If they moved to the tile before it, they'd be able to burst fire and spend 5 TU rotating.

You'd get one of those symbols / numbers for each of the four shot types, assuming your weapon is capable of it.

Please try to keep it as clean as possible. Just the symbols is fine.

Sorry if I posted it in a thread that moved on, and then the other one got locked - but my main complaint with the system was this.

I still think switching to a "shooting AP capped, remaining AP can be used for moving" system would be functionally quite similar but make the interface a lot easier to work with. We'd always know exactly how much TU something costs, so it wouldn't need to be constantly tracked, and it would be immediately clear if the end-of-move TU dropped below that amount.

Agree that if we stick with the current system, symbolic+ap-after (or maybe a symbolic-after to directly represent turns allowed?) seems to be the way to go - Exact TU costs don't matter beyond "can I fire a this thing" sort of stuff. Still means we'd be "feeling around" for where we can shoot from, which can get annoying, but removing the step of having to make the calculation each time would make it feel a lot nicer than it does now.

I look at the Tu slider to deduce the TUs I need to shoot after moving. I don't use it for reserving because It doesn't take into account crouching and turning so 5-6 TUs extra.

There is a 3 level shot system:

1-snap, 2-normal, 3-aimed=burst so Aaron's 3 bars work, or the above suggested markers. You lose marks/bars necessary for the higher leve shots. There was a game called Age of Wonders that utilized a version of this, I searched for screenshots but can't find a proper one, basically it worked as follows:

Tiles on the intended movement path of the unit was colored Green - Yellow - Red. Green was the beginning, red was the farther tiles. Most units had 2 attacks total. If they attacked enemy within their green area, they used all 2 attacks, yellow gave 2 attacks and if you yet moved further into red, you got no attacks.

Edit: I found image.

Edit: Man someone got the idea before me:

Ground Combat : Keeping TU color code

Like I said in the previous thread - notches on the TU bar to show needed TU's for various actions, and greying out a portion of the TU bar as you move the mouse around planing movement.

Simple and efficient.

I'm a big fan of the KISS design principle and elegant solutions. I'm told the change to the % based system is because aliens get too badass in late-game.

Why not address the late-game alien TU issue directly, instead of removing the cool Heavy skill that made certain weapons handle uniquely and required the player to plan out their moves, nerfing the effects of the TU skill across the board and making the game more confusing with variable TU costs so the player usually won't know by heart how many TUs are needed for a certain type of shot?

P.S. Yes, yes I have. Not all 50 million pages, but a fair bit of it.

P.P.S. Hi GlyphGryph! Fancy meeting you here! (Naros here, from CDDA IRC)

Have you read the big, now closed, thread on the topic here?