My thoughts of the milestone 4

[silencer]

Since I didn't play previous Milestone versions, I think that cleaner SMG is way overtuned. Since it's SMG it shouldn't have the range of AR, this should be of a compromise between shotgun and AR. Since it's modeled as MP5, I question it capability to make a dent in Steel Platings of Mars. I think it's range should be reduced and armor reduction removed, so the basic Cleaners won't do so much damage. You can then give the soldiers better weapon - AR

Shields are destroyed way to easily, a SMG should not be able to destroy a shield in 2 shots, I think they should get some resistances to ballistics. 

 

Soldier extraction needs a little spawning rearrengments

 

Edited June 15, 2024 by silencer

[vaBchRog]

Nice touch,  the Cleaners being with Aliens on the 1st abduction mission

 

[vaBchRog]

I never noticed this before.  I can't figure out what item my Shields have?

[vaBchRog]

Moved to Bug report
 

Edited June 16, 2024 by vaBchRog

[Skitso]

4 hours ago, vaBchRog said:

Just had this happen a Scott Ship landed and I launched a crew to take care of it.  The shield threw a grenade and Alien shot him the shield disappeared then came back.

These belong into the bug report forums.

[Skitso]

My second playthrough with MS 4.xx and again, I'm not seeing servitors or sebillian at day ~150.

 

EDIT: Within my latest 2 playthroughs, Secton/Psyon combo has been way overpresented. With both playthroughs combined (until first terror mission) I have had one (!) mission with sebillian, two with mantid and two with wraith and I've not seen a single servitor in what has to be more than 20 ground missions with aliens.

Edited June 18, 2024 by Skitso

[Skitso]

• First observer crash site with secton/psyon seemed too easy compared to other missions I had before.
• First Terror mission with secton/psyon/cyberdrone was too difficult. Three bullet sponge cyberdrones ate all my laser clips and I ran out of ammo.
  • It might be the map too. The one with the gas station has so much open space, it's hard to stay alive.
• Suppressed enemies should suffer a small (20-30%) reflex penalty so they'd be a bit easier to hit with stun baton (or other melee).
• Not sure, but I think I saw a civilian shoot and suppress an alien which in turn shot and killed the civilian (which shouldn't be possible as it should have lost all it's TU's).
  • Could it be a bug that is a result of the new turn order where civs play before aliens?
• Nerfing wraith's cloaking field was a wrong way to make them easier IMO. Reduce their armor and/or HP instead but keep the cloaking field as it's the thing that makes them different.
  • Maybe make the cloaking field effect be a curve where it's almost no use up close, but more effective further away?
• Arming aircraft weapons currently is frustrating. Things that don't fit in the current loadout should be greyed out.

Edited June 18, 2024 by Skitso

[silencer]

9 hours ago, Skitso said:

My second playthrough with MS 4.xx and again, I'm not seeing servitors or sebillian at day ~150.

I've got mine Sebiliian on day 68 (v4.8) - so you're just super unlucky.

[Skitso]

5 hours ago, silencer said:

I've got mine Sebiliian on day 68 (v4.8) - so you're just super unlucky.

Yeah, the first destroyer has forced sebillian crew (from 4.7.0 forward I think), but have you seen them again after that?

Edited June 17, 2024 by Skitso

[silencer]

Yes. I've just recently had another Destroyer with Sebillians.

[Skitso]

Having played the new intel gather map again I can confirm it's too easy. There's too many computer terminals that are too quick and easy to sabotage. Collected 20 intel and left before reinforcements could catch me..

[Chris]

I’m on holiday until next week so there won’t be any fixes on this stuff until next week, but it does seem like the Servitors not spawning is indeed a bug. 

Regarding the overly easy intel gather map, can you please attach some screenshots and maybe a save so we can easily identify which map you’re talking about?

[silencer]

I don't know, I did get 20 on Commander difficulty, and it wasn't super easy, but definetly easier than VIP escort. I would leave as is. Don't make it worse for average Joe.

[Skitso]

@silencer, getting them all on commander difficulty seems like it was very easy to you too - you didn't even lose a single soldier. Average Joes are playing on two or even three steps lower difficulty level and it'll be a breeze for them too.

Edited June 19, 2024 by Skitso

[Skitso]

57 minutes ago, Chris said:

Regarding the overly easy intel gather map, can you please attach some screenshots and maybe a save so we can easily identify which map you’re talking about?

This @Kouki's new map. (Screenshot from Silencer's video)

[Skitso]

• I really like the idea of destroyable alien base walls, but the implementation is at least currently not that visually pleasing. It's odd to see a huge flat, brown and perfectly square box appear behind a destroyed wall. Not sure if it's worth the effort to create a whole set of dirt tiles that take the direction of damage into account though. If this is the final form of this, I vote for ditching the idea completely.
• Androns smashed every single door in the alien base. It's kinda hilarious but probably not intended. This also made me realize less doors make the alien base maps more interesting.
• Alien bases are still utterly boring layout wise. I'd hope for something like death star in Star Wars. Deep chasms with narrow bridges where you can see lower levels below you. Something architecturally more strange, distinct and alien. Not just boxy rooms after rooms. Tall rooms with upper platforms, you should really go nuts with the design here.

Here's few examples I made with copilot AI.

 

Edited June 20, 2024 by Skitso

[Skitso]

Day 181. 

I've built:

• 10 guardian armour
• ~15 warden armour (replaced destroyed ones)
• full set of laser weapons (with some extra)
• fully upgraded laser weapons and a lot of other gear
• Upgraded laboratories, workshops, missile batteries and radars
• Upgraded explosives and warheads
• Upgraded aircraft and vehicle armors
• built 4 Phantoms and a Dragonfly

...and I still have more than 50pc of both alloys and alenium left. I never once had any problem to build whatever I wanted. Only the money was a limiting factor. I have not farmed crash sites extensively: I've done maybe 3 scouts, 3 destroyers, 2  observers, 1 abductor and downed maybe 3-4 probes and few fighters. Also completed 1 terror site and 1 alien base. Pretty much only things I skipped were accelerated weapons, generator upgrade, energy knife and alenium vehicle upgrades. Other than those, I've build everything I've wanted and I've always had plenty of alien materials at hand.

[Chris]

21 hours ago, silencer said:

I don't know, I did get 20 on Commander difficulty, and it wasn't super easy, but definetly easier than VIP escort. I would leave as is. Don't make it worse for average Joe.

Question is, was it the same map Skitso is talking about? With lots of palm trees around the edge?

[Skitso]

4 minutes ago, Chris said:

Question is, was it the same map Skitso is talking about? With lots of palm trees around the edge?

It was, I watched Silencer's playthrough from youtube. It was the same map and a flawless victory.

[silencer]

On 6/19/2024 at 4:28 PM, Skitso said:

@silencer, getting them all on commander difficulty seems like it was very easy to you too - you didn't even lose a single soldier. Average Joes are playing on two or even three steps lower difficulty level and it'll be a breeze for them too.

And yet Retcon Raider (don't know if you know him), playing on Veteran didn't get them all. And I think he is above average Joe level.

Though revisitng his video, he did get older map, which I believe I played in Closed Beta on v25 and I got 17 on Commander.

 

4 hours ago, Chris said:

Question is, was it the same map Skitso is talking about? With lots of palm trees around the edge?

Not sure how many is lots, but definetly there were palm trees. Skitso pasted the map I had, but let me paste another screen

 

Edited June 20, 2024 by silencer

[Skitso]

4 hours ago, silencer said:

And yet Retcon Raider (don't know if you know him), playing on Veteran didn't get them all. And I think he is above average Joe level.

Though revisitng his video, he did get older map, which I believe I played in Closed Beta on v25 and I got 17 on Commander.

Yeah, the original intel gather map is quite a lot more time consuming to comb through and thus more difficult. Can't point my finger at what exactly is it, but anyways...

[silencer]

The cover looks very unintuitive. How come 2 pile of boxes that are bigger than the discount Gatekeeper, provide only 60% of cover? For normal person it looks like a 100% blocker. The same came to my surpirse with the shelves in 7-Eleven shops. You can shoot right through them despite they looks solid.

[Skitso]

• Guardian armor feels a bit underwhelming right out of the gate. I guess I expected a bit more - A slight superiority, even for a few weeks, when I've manufactured such badass new armor tech would have felt nice. Now I'm still one shotted with plasma rifles and it doesn't feel like a small victory I had hoped.
• How about differentiating enemy types more? Mantids could be a lot weaker and have their numbers doubled to make their missions feel like a proper ant hill swarm. Androns on the other hand could be twice as tough, but have their their numbers cut in half. Stuff like that. 
• Difficulty seems to ramp up too much around day 180-220. I had a semi-manageable alien base mission, a super tough terror mission, quite difficult landed abductor (?) and a base attack where the aliens just ran over my already beat up team of rookies. Missions were so quickly back to back that I just didn't have time to recover.  I play on veteran ironman, and I just quit there.

See ya on MS5.

Edited June 23, 2024 by Skitso

[silencer]

The problem with armor is that, once you have it (The Guardian) aliens start using Plasma weapons which automatically negates the hardness of that armor, 24 of armor vs like 60 damage of plasma rifle is nothing. I don't remember if X1/X2 uses old x-com damage table 0-200% or TFTD table 50-150%, but if damage goes above the average then the armor means nothing. The same thing can be said about The Colossus armor. It's not much of an improvement over Guardian and it has several limiting factors.

The Difficulty ramp I would blame mostly on constant lack of funds

[Skitso]

6 hours ago, silencer said:

The problem with armor is that, once you have it (The Guardian) aliens start using Plasma weapons which automatically negates the hardness of that armor, 24 of armor vs like 60 damage of plasma rifle is nothing. I don't remember if X1/X2 uses old x-com damage table 0-200% or TFTD table 50-150%, but if damage goes above the average then the armor means nothing. The same thing can be said about The Colossus armor. It's not much of an improvement over Guardian and it has several limiting factors.

I hate all dynamic difficulty and level scaling systems in games - it makes progression feel unsatisfying. I know it's not exactly that in Xenonauts 2's case, but the end result of unsatisfying feel of progression is the same. This is why I also want to shoot down scouts later in the game: To see how powerful my troops and gear have become.

Edited June 23, 2024 by Skitso