Closed Beta V25 experimental branch suggestions

[Wyldefyre_CP]

So I'm only 22 game days into this new build, playing on Veteran Difficulty, but I did want to comment on a few things that I like, a few things I don't like, and a few things I think I could appreciate if they were tweaked a bit.

 

1)  Loving the Usability improvements!  Especially like the fade-out on weapons you can't use anymore that turn and keeping color on the ones you still can.  It may not seem like much, but it makes me feel warm and fuzzy after moving or shooting to see the pistol still looking all ready to go.  Not having a belt anymore is taking a little getting used to, as it's been a staple of every Xenonaut 2 game I've played up to this point, but there are at least two advantages to the 'beltless' system, and those are reloading and grenade-tossing.  Before, if you ran out of ammo/grenades in your belt, you had to spend 10 TU to grab another clip/grenade from your inventory and place it into your belt loop.  No more!  Shoot and grenade to your heart's content!  So that's a huge plus.  On the downside, I don't care for the 'demolition charge' being increased to 4 squares - MUCH preferred the 'demolition grenade' that occupied one space - in previous builds, I was still mixing a combo of demolition grenades with alenium grenades in several of my soldier builds because they did indeed come in handy.  It wasn't until the plasma grenade upgrade that they more or less became obsolete.  Eating up 4 spaces now, though, makes it a lot more difficult to justify carrying more than maybe 1 of them in a mission.  This feels a bit needlessly restrictive, but that's just my opinion.

2)  Balance Changes.  Like the idea of the End Game being pushed back to a full year as opposed to 320 days .... I actually had a game going a few builds ago where it chirped at me that the 'end of the world' was coming in another month ... we had 3 solid bases up and 2 good aircraft in each base, soldier squads finally getting a decent work out, research and engineering going full bore at the main base, and poof!  I called the game's bluff - hadn't seen a single city getting destroyed by the killer laser - figured maybe this was the start of that happening, but no, it was Poof!  The whole game is over instead.  To be honest, I don't care for that concept at all.  Makes the game way too linear and plot-dependent at a point where I feel most people are finally starting to enjoy the actual game.  Call me crazy, I prefer a longer haul with this game.  What would have been understandable would have been the aliens trotting out the City Eraser after those 320-365 days and then start scrubbing cities off the globe.  Panic levels could have been adjusted to make that a much tougher pill to swallow, but the whole game over?  Show me!  At least put a Total Annihilation image in there - though preferably a cut-scene when the game is completely finished - to show that the payer's game is finished ... maybe I need more coffee and to shut up?  Yes, most likely so ....

3) Balance Changes, continued.  Structures quicker to build - YES!  A resounding YES!!!  Now a few of them just need to be a bit cheaper, especially since monthly funding is getting reduced and sell-back has gotten horribly nerfed ... speaking of nerfed selling - I get the concept, but reducing stuff all the way down to 25% of what they were initially worth is ... well .... it's a very tough pill to swallow.  I noticed you did start some things (like corpses) at twice the initial value they had previously been going for, which is nice until you get hit by that redux, which doesn't take long at all to trigger.  Case in point, I currently have 15 Alien Mag Weapons, 10 Cleaner Corpses, 15 Secton Corpses and 3 Psyon Corpses sitting in storage after 22 days .... Ordinarily, I'd be out the gate selling these things to further my base construction, purchase weapons for my aircraft, or hiring some more scientists or engineers, since my new workshop, lab and living quarters are already good to go, but I  don't feel like I can sell them, because of the huge hit to value I will take .... especially the mag weapons .... doing a save scum, I sold 14 of my 15 and the value drops from 10K each all the way down to 3K, just for selling 14 of the things.  Mag weapons are something you collect a decent number of during the first few months of the game, and to think that quickly they'll be down to be worth so little, well .... that would throw a huge hole in my plans for expansion.  But sitting on stockpiles and not getting rolling out the gate is also a detriment I'm not happy with taking.  I feel like those of us who actually like the ground combat are being unfairly pigeon-holed into playing the game a different way.  I could see dropping the overall value of items down somewhat, but more like from 100% down to 75%, and only after a fair amount of volume has been sold, not right out the gate like this.  It's that, or don't charge 200K for each missile or torpedo mount on every aircraft coming off the line, and make those 1 time engineer upgrades like grenades and medkits.  I actually don't mind paying individual aircraft mount costs, but those will need to be reduced a good deal if we're going to get hampered in raising cash this badly ... which, again, is just my opinion after playing this iteration for 22 days.

 

Pretty sure I have some other thoughts on the game but I need a break from typing so this is it for the moment!  Please don't take the criticisms too harshly.

   

  

[Chris]

Thanks. Yeah, this stuff is useful - don't worry about it sounding harsh. Provided you're not calling the dev team idiots it's always useful to hear what you don't like and would like changed, because that's the best way for us to fix problems affecting the community.

Specific comments:

• Glad you like the usability improvements!
• The Demolition Grenades have been increased to 2x2 because the plan is to merge them with the C4 in the long term by giving them a fire mode that allows them to be remotely detonated. Also, they're kinda overpowered as a 1x1 grenade, I think - they do almost as much damage as a frag grenade but also wreck terrain and armour very effectively. In some ways not being able to have two of these per soldier per mission makes decisions about how best to use them more interesting. But I'll keep an eye on it.
• The whole abrupt "end of the game" thing is a bit placeholder right now, as is most of the late game. I think in practice it'll probably end up being something like what you suggest, where after you wait too long the game starts blasting cities from orbit and Panic rapidly gets out of control, but if your strategic situation was solid then you still have a month or two before the game actually ends.
• Sure, the numbers on the sell prices might need to be tweaked. It's possible to adjust both the minimum price and the drop for each item sold on each individual item, so I'm sure we can find something that works - I've not worked on the numbers that much yet. The system is only really intended to penalise people if they are doing more than 2 crash sites per UFO type, so maybe the numbers are dropping too fast at the moment. But in principle I do think having the choice between stockpiling items for a bigger stack of cash in the future or selling them immediately to fund quicker expansion is an interesting choice. 

[Wyldefyre_CP]

@Chris  Thanks for the speedy reply on the feedback!  Yeah, I keep my 'idiot' accusations very close to the vest!  

Glad to hear the 'end of the game' thing isn't etched in stone just yet, and that the sell prices might be adjusted to a happy medium.  I would tentatively suggest that instead of penalizing people for doing more than 2 of the same crash site - I try to do every one that I have enough healthy soldiers to get to, and I still find myself with not enough cash to do everything I'd like to do in the game  - there are other steps you could take.  For instance, aliens that were already dead upon crash could also have their items already destroyed, making for a few less items to sell.  You could also reduce the amount of alenium, alloys and other ship components harvested in a crash - to be honest, I don't sell alenium or alloys unless I absolutely need to, and then, quite sparingly, because I always feel I will need every bit of it!  Reducing the overall value of items a bit, instead of a drastic trade redux is another option to consider, or upping the auto-harvest value to be in closer contention to what actually doing the missions rewards, leaving the main reason to go on more missions, other than enjoyment, being the improvement of skills, promotions, and awards.

 

I'll hold out on selling stuff a bit longer .... one month has passed and the big hit I expected to find on the funding page was not as bad as I thought it would be ... will start selling some items after the next alien or cleaner encounter, most likely, and hold off on the price redux assessment for a few game months  before I weigh back in again.

 

On a totally unrelated note, any chance we might get some wreckage/destruction trails implemented into the maps at some point going forward?  Not looking for something that's going to be hugely time consuming or art intensive, like gaps in the ufo hull, but some untraverseable ditches or burning patches of grass, felled or sheered trees, etc. might add some zing.

 

P.S.  Darn it, forgot to add, in regards to the 4 square charges - maybe consider a 2 square brick?  Aside from the machine gun belts and the heavy ammo rounds, I don't know of much else that's employing the 2 square option atm, seems like that could be a useful offset vs 1 or 4?

Edited December 11, 2022 by Wyldefyre_CP

[Wyldefyre_CP]

Alloy Plating, $500K ?!  A x5 markup from the Ablative?  Wha .... wait, whazzat?  'This will upgrade the armor plating on our vehicles and aircraft to be Alloy plating, increasing their survivability.'  Ok, it's a one shot deal .... whew .... exhales .... puts down the paper bag .... 

[Alienkiller]

First Chris and Dev-Team I wanna say thanks for the solid V.25-Version. Playing as ususal on Veteran-Difficulty.

V.24 was the first Version I could test up to some more Advanced Equipment for Interceptors, Transport, Equipment for Soldiers / Combat-Vehicle etc.

I´m in Day 44 or 45 again in that solid V.25-Beta. Did a lot of Maps already (new Arctic, new Abduction and the better adjustet Farms etc.) in the first Missions and done first Basic-Researches incl. the first Alien-Fighter-Aircraft, which is in that Days very seldom.

In many Parts I can aggree with Wildefyre_CP, in some others not.

1. Positve Things I have seen so far in the new Version:

- Aliens: they now have the missing special Abilitys, which make the Groundfight very interessting; you as Xenonauts-Leader sitting on the Monitor have to use your Brain fully, otherwise you will lose your Soldiers (dosen´t matter you have the Defender-Armour, Warden Combat-Armour with / without Steel Plates and the Tactical Suit with only Steel-Plates)

- UFOs: Now the Scout and Destroyer as well as first Alien-Fighter work combined. I have done an Ground Mission and lost my Soldiers after that, because I have overseen the 2 Alien-Fighters which shoot down my Skyhawk. After that I have learnd to shoot the Fighters first and send my Troops then (naturaly with Reloading).

- Missions: they work very good atm (Abduction, light Assaults from the Aliens / Cleaners, Crash-Sites). Haven´t seen the City Maps yet (the first is the Cleaner-Bureau) which will be investigated.

- Base-Screen: The new Lab- and Workshop-Screen is great. Keep that up. The other Base-Screens which are in previous Versions implemented or get an Rework work (Base-Buildup, Storage, Soldier-Quarters etc.) are now great too.

- Equipment: I like the new Equipment, which get integrated for the old Vest-System. Therefore I thought, it wouldn´t work, but it integrates perfect. The new special Slot for the MARS / ARES looks cool. Hope to Research something soon to use it.

- Soldier-Equipment / Aircraft-Equipment: That the Accelerated Weapons (the Standard-Weapon-Upgrade) is not unlimited was clear for me. I hoped too like many others, that this Upgrade were Unlimited, but the Production System gives you new Possibilitys [which I explain later].

- Soldier-Reduction from Beginn: Very good Choise, because you are a secret Organisation and no military Barracks, which can be noticed from several Miles. There I have an Idea too to use the limitated Soldiers you get in such Games [new XCOM, UFO After-Series, UFO ET-Series and many Fan-Projects].

- Difficulty-Settings: Thank you all for integrating the Differences there. Now you can make an comparision between them. Therefore it would be good, if the Beginners (Open-Beta-Testers which aren´t familar or not so familar with that Games) use the both Easy-Settings (Soldier / ?????) and the real Experts (esp. those which have played the Game in Veteran on Ironman) the General-Setting.

- Stability of the Game: Yes, the most important Point. The stability is now there with some Lags in the Maps / Geoscape (the thinking Time for the PC). Like in V.24 it dosen´t break the Game or make CTDs anymore. I hadn´t any in my 2 Playthroughts from V.24 and think it will be much better with the new testable V.25-Beta-Version.

- End Game-Date: Thanks for Upgrading the atm. End-Game-Date to 365 Days. But for the long-time-Effect it would be good to adjust it to the Double or Tripple to give the Player more Fun as well as Abilitys.

 

Now the not so good Things:

- End Game-Date: It´s to short for an fully Gameplay. For the Beta-Tests it´s fully OK, but in the Early Access it have to minimum Doubled, better Trippeld. I say it only, because I know the unexpected End-Game-Date from old X-Com too good and the problematic End-Game-Timer from Phoenix Point & UFO-After-Series. 

- Oportunitys for the Player: With the short End-Game-Date the differnt End-Game-Parts can´t be done. There the 4 or 5 Endgame-Parts from Phoenix-Point or the ones from XCOM 2 / UFO 2 ET are great if you manage the Timer before Humanty get lost completely. Such End-Game-Parts make the Game more interessting then only the classical one.

- Upgrades: Sadly there are to less 1-Time-Upgrade-Projects for exsiting Equipment / Weapons / Buildings you have already after Researches. Yes, some Upgrades for Buildings are excellent [f. e. Laser-Turret, Advanced-Workshop / Laboratorys, Generators]. But for other Parts in all 3 Categorys are something missing.

- Geoscape: Sadly some good Stuff is still Missing from previous Versions [like smaller Outposts, own Agents, more Action from the Cleaners and so on]

- Wreckage-Salvage: Sadly it´s not showing up if you do 2 Attacks (esp. when an bigger UFO get escorted). If it´s seperate with Fighters or Bombes it works very good.

- UFOPedia: Sadly the Time wasn´t used to upgrade and correct some more Entrys there as well as bring more new Entrys, esp. for the Basic-Researches / more advanced Basic-Researches

 

Suggestion for the Fixes / V.26 Beta-Version:

- Upgrades for Accelerated Weapons [Fighter-Equipment]: 4 Experimental-Upgrades from the Gattling-Gun to the Accelarted-Gun

- Upgrades for Accelerated Weapons [Soldier-Equipment]: 2 Shotguns, 2 Rifles, 4 Pistols, 2 LMGs and 2 Sniper-Rifles get the Experimental-Upgrades too for your existing Soldiers (10 Soldiers)

- Upgrades for Defender-Armour to Warden Combat-Armour [Soldier-Equipment]: 6 Expermental-Upgrades too for your existing Defender-Armours

- Upgrades for Explosives [Grenades / Missles / Torpeodos]: 1 Time-Upgrades for all existing upgradeable Parts for Fighters and the Standard-MARS (Missles / Torpedos); the Grenade-Upgrade work like it should.

- new Production-System / Research-System: Like said, there I have an Idea to make more Money. I reactivate the old testet System for that Tech-Steps we had in the medium V.10-Versions. Short said the famous Licence-System: If you have f. e. the Accelerated Weapons Researched and Tested you get weekly an Licence-Fee for that Weapons from your AI-Helpers (Police / Military / Civil Defense) [let us say 50.000 Credits] about the not so effective Versions from Standard-Human Tech they can use. The same for upgraded Armours which that Helpers use then.

- new Production-System / Research-System: Something similar I have in Mind for the Military-Airforce from your AI-Helpers f. e. the Accelerated Cannons / Armour-Upgrades etc.  

- new Production-System / Research-System: You can dismentle the Alien-Mag-Weapons and higher Tear-Weapons for more Ressources and upgrade your existing Ammunition with Alien-Ammunition. That´s an big Point which the refited UFO ET-Series brings in. In UFO 2 ET you can upgrade your Standard-Weapon Ammunition (sadly you have only an Rifle there atm) 3 Times. That would be an big improvement for Xenonauts 2 too.

- Asap fill the Gap from the UFO-Pedia [Basic-Research and Advanced-Basic Research from Interrogations Sebilian, Psion, Mantid, Wraith and Cleaner], missing Autopsys [Andron, Brute] as well as from Equipment [Tactical Armour, Ballistic Weapons, Stun Weapons, Defender-Armour, Tissue Regeneration, Alien Electronics, Reinforced Alloys, Alien PSI-Amp]

- Asap corrections from UFO-Pedia [Basic Research from Skyhawk-Dropship-Description] and integration from missing Pictures for Placeholder-Pictures where an description is already there.  

That´s my Thoughts and Suggestions so far for the newest Game-Version.

Edited December 12, 2022 by Alienkiller