Johnny_B

How do people assault UFOs in this version?

20 posts in this topic

I've started going through the game again with CE enabled and am enjoying it for the most part, but I cannot figure out how to take UFOs without heavy losses. The problem is that, as soon as I approach the UFO, aliens will start popping out the door, taking a shot at my troops, then running back inside. There is often no good cover between my guys and the UFO to prevent this. Then, if I manage to get close enough, opening the door leaves me without enough TUs to do anything else. Even if I manage to do something like take a shot, aliens will often shoot me back during my turn and kill 2-3 troops this way. I must have replayed the same UFO assault mission 5 or 6 times just to try out different strategies and nothing seems to work. I know the CE changes a few things like reaction fire, door mechanics etc. So what do I do?

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If you are looking for guides there should be some on steam.

If you are stuck why dont you watch some other people play ? There are a lot of lets play on youtube.

If you dont like the door you can shoot it open.

 

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I've found a few guides but they only give very general information and basic tips. The only let's play I found was Scott Manley's, and I don't think he's playing with CE because he doesn't seem to have my problems - namely, I open the door and get shot in the face. Or I shoot an alien and he returns fire and kills me, during my turn. Repeatedly.

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This is going to rather lengthy and "rambled"-multi-part-post. But should be well informative too.
Bare in mind, that this is rather spoilery too.

Semi-forewords:
True, the Alien-AI is a little bit too "smart". In all fairness, it is almost playing like a human for the "last stand" and such. And you could argue them also being "ESPers" is lore-faithful (sebilian having thermal-vision, androns sensors, etc.).
And if there there is something this game has taught me, "save-scumming" for the sake of finding the counter-tactics against cheap'ish alien-AI has been 100% okay.

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Your greatest enemy:
Especially inside UFOs, your greatest enemy are going to be "super-TU-pin-point-calculating-explosion-geniuses" ("commanders" and other higher-rank extraterrestrials carrying a grenade to begin with, that is). For the most part even the always useful mighty shield-units are for the most part helpless against grenades because they simply phase-through the shields of their target (I.E. always land behind the shield). And all your characters with less than 60-health-points (with or without armour) are more than likely going to be killed (unless of course by sheer luck the Xenonaut resists either for none or minimal damage).

Well, there's also the explosion-gun-toters. But at least those guys actually need (bit of wonky) line-of-sight to begin with, so you can at least reaction-shot those guys.

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The Beginning-phase / Breaching the UFO:
So, aside for having your UFO-raiding consisting of valiant-shield units to take on the face-shots, how so you fight against (non-andron) door and corner-campers?

Well, for starters we need to "give some of their own medicine" and exploit slightly, kind of; lore-wise this tactic actually would be 100% thing happening.
But let's get this started right from the beginning (I'll try to make this as detailed as possible since I currently lack screenshots to demonstrate this):

1. Gather all you troops around the doorways, preferable ~8-squares away or otherwise using diagonal and various other covered placements (which vary from depending on the UFOs).

2. Most important: (stun-)Gas the doors, if there are non-androns dabbling with them that is. You can do this by first ready your stun-gas-grenade and adjust the aim into the door. You'll know the grenade is aimed "into" the door when the door itself is highlighted in green. If it doesnät, you're either not close enough to the door or you have the wrong throwing angle.
Gassing the door not only possibly knocks-down the organic-non-helmet-wearing enemies, but also temporarily makes them hesitant entering the squares covered by gas.
2.1. Alternatively you can try simply try to destroy the doors with explosives with the risk of destroying the enemy and the artifacts / money behind it.
((I personally prefer having doors because it is extra time-units for aliens to use too when they need to open it (especially the case with "grenadiers") plus they give more cover to Xenonauts to form around the doors.))

 

Hopefully you pretty much have been using the time-unit-reserving-feature for the "Snap-shots" to enable the "Reaction-shots" (as you should have been right from get go).
Though let's have some important info-injection(s) here in the middle, because semi-unfortunately the players needs to get into in-depth with this: Static time-unit-consumptions.
If the GameManual-pdf (found within the gamefiles) and the "wikia" are still up-to-date, the (most notable) consumptions should be like this:
- Movement and crouch-toggle: 3-TUs per square and toggle (same goes with flight)
- Turning: 1-TU per 45-degrees
- Doors: 6-TUs (and same thing with trans / teleporters
- Grenades: 50% of TUs + 8-TUs with full hands (when using the quick-grenades-slots)
- Guns and other equipments: Variable %-TU-usage

Same consumption-rules apply to aliens; use this info to your advantage to (especially the highlighted / bolded-sections).
((If someone knows every TU-usage-info via a XML-files or something similar, feel free to correct or otherwise inform me; I just didn't have the luck find all of the info.))


Securing the elevators:
So now you have hopefully breached into the UFO and possibly are now facing the "elevators": This is going to be the most difficult part in the UFO-capturing.

3. Provided you have made sure the bottom floor has been completely cleaned, start grouping your raiders to "overwatch" the teleporters. Try keep ~8-squares away from those until your next full-TU-replenished turn to avoid camping grenadiers jumping between the floors.
After this turn, start surrounding the teleporters from at least four (4) directions. Toggle the crouch when initially reaching the spot to allow any Xenonaut behind safely reaction-shot any elevator-camper still alive (for this specific elevator, that is).
4. Once you have had at least one safe turns, start preparing your most TU-rich xenonaut to scout the room the teleporter leads to, first by making him / her stand (that "measly" 3-TUs could be the thing that either saves or kills you).
5. If there are enemies still camping around the teleporters (spotted by the scout), return your scout back to consider best strategy to be used to clean the room (assault with TU-rich and very high-reflexed shotgunner, one xenonaut to suppress the camper, whatever strategy suits the situation and your style best).
5.1 Provided the destination room has been cleared, start moving rest of your team into the new room.


Clearing out rest of the UFO (Command-room and "above"):
This is very the capturing-process gets the most tricky (especially if there are more than two floors), because now you're entering the / a ultimate-territory of the grenade-campers (unless of course you are fighting androns; they only have the super-kaboom-sticks to worry about).

Your best weapon of choice here is suppression (unless of course they're androns).
For the sake of refresher: Suppression not only disables the reaction-fire, but it also halves the time-units for the next turn. Or if suppressed twice in the same turn, no TUs at all.

At this point of the game (when you start facing "elevator-UFOs), you should already have EMP-grenades (or something equivalent depending on which version of the game and with what mods you're playing with).
These grenades not only are very good for capturing or otherwise taking down resilient units (helmets, androns, etc.). But they also have good suppression-capabilities; two of these (2x60-suppression-points) even close-enough to campers (~2-squares away form the damage-zone / Area-of-Effect / Splash-zone) should suppress the unit(s).

By keeping close eyes on your Time-Unit-pool and suppressing the rooms thus denying aliens from ever throwing grenades or reflex-killing your soldiers, you should be able to tidy up rest of the UFO-interiors.


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A summary:

So this guide of mine can summarized with these crucial-steps (aside also of course studying the static time-unit-costs):
1. Gas the doors!
2. Scout carefully!!
3. Suppress everything!!!..aside of course your own team; you really want to avoid accidental team-suppressions...
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Extra
Pave's Ideal UFO-recovery-team:
If it wasn't already obvious, I really-really like shield units in this game. Not only they can take up to 160-damage worth of shots into their face. But they can also carry a lot-lot of grenades (provided they have the minimum strength of 60, that is).
At least half my teams are always shield units, unless I am recovering a "Scout"-UFO. (In Community-Edition, that is).
Rest of my team consists Riflemen (close-range-burst-fire and semi-long-range-sharpshooting, plus good reaction-fire-chance), maybe couple of Assaults (if they both lack reflexes and have low strength too, but then have high TU-pool), and perhaps a single Sniper with high reflexes (if I am fighting in open-areas, especially against Harridans).

And that's pretty much it without going too much into spoilers.

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6 hours ago, Pave said:

And if there there is something this game has taught me, "save-scumming" for the sake of finding the counter-tactics against cheap'ish alien-AI has been 100% okay.

Sace scumming never teaches you anything, it just rolls the dice again, imho. Im playing with way harder mods and way higher difficulty levels and deal with problems on ironman.

6 hours ago, Pave said:

Hopefully you pretty much have been using the time-unit-reserving-feature for the "Snap-shots" to enable the "Reaction-shots" (as you should have been right from get go).

Snapshots always work regardless of any reserving bar.

6 hours ago, Pave said:

Same consumption-rules apply to aliens; use this info to your advantage to (especially the highlighted / bolded-sections).
((If someone knows every TU-usage-info via a XML-files or something similar, feel free to correct or otherwise inform me; I just didn't have the luck find all of the info.))

Movementet, Doors, weapon change: config.xml
grenades: weapons_gc.xml

 

Otherwise, good guide !

 

For bigger UFOs i only found this. Its X-Division but it contains a lot of advanced techniques to use. May or may not be useful:

 

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Thank you for the guide Pave. I'll try a few of those thing, especially stun grenades which I haven't really used so far.

The problem with suppression is that I have to see enemies first in order to suppress them, and what usually happens is that I get shot whenever I open a door/go around a corner. I can't help but think that CE made the aliens a little TOO good at camping compared to the base game. But I'll keep trying, and we'll see.

Edited by Johnny_B

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1 hour ago, Johnny_B said:

The problem with suppression is that I have to see enemies first in order to suppress them, and what usually happens is that I get shot whenever I open a door/go around a corner. I can't help but think that CE made the aliens a little TOO good at camping compared to the base game. But I'll keep trying, and we'll see

Yup, hence why having high-reflexed soldiers as scout is super important (even when playing on "Easy"-difficulty);ideally the super-high-relex-shield units are your best guys to open the doors at the moment.

Elevator-scouting-wise, thankfully spinning around doesn't trigger the reaction-shot-checks; only moving and actual actions (shooting, throwing grenades, opening doors, etc.).

Studying the line-of-sights is something very worth imprinting into your eyes too when attempting to raid some corners too.



Suppression-wise you're (most likely) indeed going to have most difficult with the androns since, as I wrote quite many times, they cannot with suppressed. Pretty much the only counter against these again are the super-high-reflex shield-carriers, alongside being able to execute the mass-chain-EMP-grenade-strike once you have created a safe situation to pull that off
E.G. spot one of the corner-campers with one scout from the other end of the room and process to chug grenades from the blind-side of the camper).
 

2 hours ago, Charon said:

Sace scumming never teaches you anything, it just rolls the dice again, imho.


Well, I was using the term "save-scumming" rather liberally.

But my point was that primarily through this practice I've learned to counter various "cheats" the "Alien Intelligence" uses (especially the very annoying super-blind grenade-chugging over the high-walls the "ESPers"(-Sebillians) are practicing really often.
Using the door-TU-consumption to deny cheap-grenade-deaths is also something I learned via this practice (as in, in Xenonauts it's "basic-procedure-behavioral-procedure", while in "Original Xcom"-games grenades were simply very chaotically random (at least in my experiences); I.E. in Xenonauts grenades are the primary choice of damage dealing if TUs allow the AI is allowed the "hit-and-run" with those, while in "O-Xcom" it was more of a "panic-button" to aliens (at least inside the UFOs while playing the OpenXcom-edition)).


In the end though, I don't feel any less of being a worse-players due save-scumming; hence I was able to write this hopefully guiding-thing to begin with.
This is especially to consider that while there is dice-rolling in this (and Old Xcom-games), there are still a lot of guarantees one can do (E.G. point-blank shots are going to hit pretty much 100%-chance, suppression can be guaranteed with enough EMP-grenades, etc. anything that isn't super-long-range-shots can be more or less guaranteed to happen, in my experiences at least.)

 

 

 

2 hours ago, Charon said:

Snapshots always work regardless of any reserving bar.

Well it was more of making 100%-certain that you are reaction-shotting than accidentally spending too many TUs to not be able to reaction-shot-check to begin with; ideally you could reserve for "normal"-shots and either have a chance for two reaction-shots or otherwise just higher chance to do the reaction-shot.

It is somewhat nasty Xenonauts is missing the reserving-toggle for the crouching too while Xcom/UFO & Terror from deep had this button. But thankfully it's just additional 3-TUs and the possible turning one needs to calculate manually.

 

2 hours ago, Charon said:

config.xml


Thank you; I just simply had been searching with wrong key-words (like "TU", "Time Units", and so one instead of "Action Points" or "AP")
 

<AP>
		<MoveAP>3</MoveAP>
		<MoveAPDiagonal>4</MoveAPDiagonal>
		<TurnAP>1</TurnAP>
		<KneelingAP>3</KneelingAP>
		<KneeledTurnAP>1</KneeledTurnAP>
		<StairAP>2</StairAP>
		<DoorOpenAP>6</DoorOpenAP>
		<DoorCloseAP>6</DoorCloseAP>
		<DoorLargeOpenAP>6</DoorLargeOpenAP>
		<DoorLargeCloseAP>6</DoorLargeCloseAP>
		<HandsFreeingAP>8</HandsFreeingAP>
		<HandDragAP>12</HandDragAP>
		<BackpackDragAP>4</BackpackDragAP>
		<BeltDragAP>4</BeltDragAP>
		<GroundDragAP>0</GroundDragAP>
		<JumpPackVertAP>5</JumpPackVertAP>
		<JumpPackHorzAP>3</JumpPackHorzAP>
		<JumpPackHorzAPDiag>3</JumpPackHorzAPDiag>
		<TeleportAP>30</TeleportAP>
		<ExtraVaultAP>4</ExtraVaultAP>
		<ExplosiveArmingAP>2</ExplosiveArmingAP>
		<ExplosiveUnarmingAP>1</ExplosiveUnarmingAP>
		<CrushableGrassAP>2</CrushableGrassAP>
		<DropshipMissionsAlienStartAPModifier>0.5</DropshipMissionsAlienStartAPModifier>


I merely inserted the info here just for the sake of confirmation (at least for myself).
Plus it has some other nice info for rest of players who are interested in (especially to those who end up using med-packs a lot during ground-combat).

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Edited by Pave

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Didn't want to start a new topic, but that is it, I am quitting this game. I bring my highest-reflex shield units forward, open a door, and two aliens on the other side get free shots on me. My last mission I entered a large scout UFO and there were FIVE sebillians camping inside, at least 3 of which got free shots as soon as I went through the door. I can still get through by reloading and trying different things, but that just feels like trial and error gameplay. What's the point? I don't know if it's CE or the base game, but this feels like something that has not been properly tested. And to be honest, it's just not fun anymore. Glad I didn't spend a lot of money on this game.

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3 hours ago, Pave said:

But my point was that primarily through this practice I've learned to counter various "cheats" the "Alien Intelligence" uses (especially the very annoying super-blind grenade-chugging over the high-walls the "ESPers"(-Sebillians) are practicing really often.

This seems to be exactly what im talking about, instead of facing a problem with casualities you distort the result by backtracking time.

In the end its just a matter of choice about playing style.

 

All in all i think we are pretty much on the same page.

Its all cool, i just want to tell you that you miss out on a different kind of experience and the maturing of skills which comes with it.

3 hours ago, Pave said:

It is somewhat nasty Xenonauts is missing the reserving-toggle for the crouching too while Xcom/UFO & Terror from deep had this button. But thankfully it's just additional 3-TUs and the possible turning one needs to calculate manually.

Just calculate everything manually, its not that hard.

 

58 minutes ago, Johnny_B said:

Didn't want to start a new topic, but that is it, I am quitting this game. I bring my highest-reflex shield units forward, open a door, and two aliens on the other side get free shots on me. My last mission I entered a large scout UFO and there were FIVE sebillians camping inside, at least 3 of which got free shots as soon as I went through the door. I can still get through by reloading and trying different things, but that just feels like trial and error gameplay. What's the point? I don't know if it's CE or the base game, but this feels like something that has not been properly tested. And to be honest, it's just not fun anymore. Glad I didn't spend a lot of money on this game.

There he goes ... .

There goes another player which was educated by todays games to not think himmself out of a disadvantageous position. Its not fully his fault though, there is practically no other guidance available.

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2 hours ago, Charon said:

There he goes ... .

There goes another player which was educated by todays games to not think himmself out of a disadvantageous position. Its not fully his fault though, there is practically no other guidance available.

Like what? What can I possibly do when aliens just camp inside UFOs with full TUs and shoot me the instant I open a door or step into a room? I already tried using shields, tried using troops with high reflex scores, tried using grenades. Sometimes it works, but many times it doesn't. And when it doesn't, I always lose 1 or 2 soldiers. If there is something else that can be done, by all means please tell me.

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Well, i had a beginners "i take you by the hand" video series in mind, but if you are on steam you can stream and chat with me while playing. How does that sound ?

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Twitch is another option too. Both way, i can play and you learn, or visus verca.

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Search for the group X_Division on steam, im the administrator there. Twitch is ... Charon117 i think.

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Thank you for the offer, but I just had another disastrous mission and realized this game isn't fun for me, so I already uninstalled and deleted it. Thanks anyway. Mods please delete this thread.

Edited by Johnny_B

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I agree with Johnny that alien camping is an obvious problem of xce to the point of frustration.

In addition to tough UFO assault, once I have to chase a lone Sebillian guard - supposed to be the dumbest of a dumb, short-sighted, aggressive close range unit - across half the map and cornered him behind some indestructable big rocks.  And it won't come out until I close the net very, very, *very* slowly to be able to lob a grenade across the corner safely.

It's not fun.

Some players may enjoy chasing a enemy like this, frequently, and consider it challenging. I feel like wasting my time.
(Edit: And if I leave a soldier to keep it in check so that I can assault the ufo, it will pop out, got hit, kill the shooter, and go back to regen.  I opt to load game, thanks.)

Edited by Sheepy

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17 hours ago, Johnny_B said:

I bring my highest-reflex shield units forward, open a door, and two aliens on the other side get free shots on me.

How this sounds to me is that you're not aware that most of the doors can simply be opened by "pushing" it, ala like say how SWAT usually does when they don't want to use breach-charges or something similar.

In case you aren't aware of this info, you can also open the doors also while standing on the side of them with the "right click" (same button you use to turn around your Xenonauts) while looking at the diagonally.
The following example image shows the mouse-cursor turning into "door"-icon when your right-click interacts with the doors.
((Open the images in a new browser-tab in order to see them in full-view))
20170112073001_1.jpg.
((This image is the same type of UFO @Charon showed in their video.
My team is "only" made of 10-xenonauts on a "Shriek"-dropship; no one is wearing an advanced-armour.))


In other words just like the aliens can dabble with the doors without moving, Xenonauts can do that which mostly doesn't either being suspected to reaction-fire.

The following image shows my team successfully formed behind the doors of the next door.
20170112093003_1.jpg

The whole tactic of mine is extremely slow. But so far has worked pretty well.



True, door-opening function is something even I wish the Instruction-Booklet / Manual of this game would tell us.
But then again the oversight is kinda understandable since this game was primarily made by old-Xcom-fans for the older-Xcom-fans (I just hope the Xenonauts 2 has "graphs" though (especially to see the funding-changes and such).

 

16 hours ago, Charon said:

This seems to be exactly what im talking about, instead of facing a problem with casualities you distort the result by backtracking time.

In the end its just a matter of choice about playing style.

 

All in all i think we are pretty much on the same page.

Its all cool, i just want to tell you that you miss out on a different kind of experience and the maturing of skills which comes with it.

Playstyles and such aside, my primary problem with Xenonauts mostly only has been the lack of visible or otherwise available data, especially the data that has been written by other players (I'll sort of explain this, don't worry).
Accepting results and such I have zero-problems with generally speaking (I otherwise wouldn't be playing say online-games with perme-death features like "Darkwind: War on Wheels"; "cheating" or otherwise "exploiting" is something I cannot agree with anything (case in point in this game the "camping ESPer grenade-tosser-AI", or the situations where they are exploiting bugs that even I have reported). 


Like I mentioned, I have a decent amount experience with original-Old-Xcom-games (having beaten the first one and dabbling with the TfTD since it first reaches the shores of Finland in 1995).
(Open)Xcom in general of course has the advantage of the +20-years head-start when it comes to not only to development of the game but also the datamining and so on.
In other words, the game has been pretty much explored to the "last bit" (although still ongoing).
((On a related note, you should be soon seeing a thread in which I'll be requesting some info I haven't able to find but would be very useful for "Online Xenopedia" (like the Wikia-site and such).))


My save-scumming-habit (as apologetic as it sounds) has been more of a "beta-tester"-style of AI-behaviour-observing, rather than not "backtracking" or otherwise not wanting to accept the results.
I.E. I've been more of testing and trying to find out best strategies against the cheap-tactics the AI utilizes (and perhaps use the gathered data for future video-game development to create more "fair" and otherwise "organic" bot-intelligence).
 

1 hour ago, Sheepy said:

In addition to tough UFO assault, once I have to chase a lone Sebillian guard - supposed to be the dumbest of a dumb, short-sighted, aggressive close range unit - across half the map and cornered him behind some indestructable big rocks.  And it won't come out until I close the net very, very, *very* slowly to be able to lob a grenade across the corner.

It's not fun.

Some people may enjoy chasing a "tough" enemy like this and consider it a challenge.


This is the age-old-problem ever since the first Xcom-game.

But thankfully Xenonauts has the 5-turns-to-capture-this-UFO-rule in this game. (And it appears that some OpenXcom-modders and other coders are trying to code-in a similar "surrender"-feature).
I personally just leave the singular wanderers alone, even if it's a loss of +10K$; but then again my primarily goal is to Strength-train my soldiers at this point (having fought +100 battles to this point).

Sure, base defence and assaults still require you kill all the aliens in order to have full-success. But at least we haven't been in need of tracking-devices like we used to in O-Xcom.

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Edited by Pave

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1 hour ago, Pave said:

This is the age-old-problem ever since the first Xcom-game.

Thankfully Xenonauts has the 5-turns-to-capture-this-UFO-rule in this game. (And it appears that some OpenXcom-modders and other coders are trying to code-in a similar "surrender"-feature).
I personally just leave the singular wanderers alone, even if it's a loss of +10K$; but then again my primarily goal is to Strength-train my soldiers at this point (having fought +100 battles to this point).

Yes, is aware of that and have captured ufo that way.  I know someone will mention this so I noted in an edit how that attempt ended up.

I, too, have played the original x-com, tftd, and so on.  And I remember how you can destroy ufo walls so that the defenders have nowhere to hide.
No need of scanner is good. But anyway I was just comparing with the base game where the sebillians seems to be more aggressive, or at least don't hide well.

Sometimes the hide and seek game is satisfying, like the time when the alien flee to second floor and I just C4 the house.
But overall the increased tendency to flee and hide and camp s a net negative to me.
I may get it wrong, I only played the base game into January, but that's what I feel.

Edited by Sheepy

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10 minutes ago, Sheepy said:

I remember how you can destroy ufo walls so that the defenders have nowhere to hide.

Old-Xcom-game advantage indeed was that they were build into pixel-graphics, unlike the really beautiful 2D-(sprite?)-art we have here (well, point being the Xcom was made with "just squares" while Xenonauts is drawn in "paintings"; but this all goes into too many technicalities).

It's gonna be very interesting to see how well the full-3D-models will eventually enable the environmental-destruction in the second Xenonauts-game (or at the minimum I want to be able to walk on the dropships and UFOs again).

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4 hours ago, Sheepy said:

I agree with Johnny that alien camping is an obvious problem of xce to the point of frustration.

In addition to tough UFO assault, once I have to chase a lone Sebillian guard - supposed to be the dumbest of a dumb, short-sighted, aggressive close range unit - across half the map and cornered him behind some indestructable big rocks.  And it won't come out until I close the net very, very, *very* slowly to be able to lob a grenade across the corner safely.

It's not fun.

Some players may enjoy chasing a enemy like this, frequently, and consider it challenging. I feel like wasting my time.
(Edit: And if I leave a soldier to keep it in check so that I can assault the ufo, it will pop out, got hit, kill the shooter, and go back to regen.  I opt to load game, thanks.)

Just calling it out, but X-Division changes this campy behaviour, we have the most experienced AI developer on our team, and even if it occurs it gives you adequate tools to deal with this kind of situation.

Heres an example of an attack and counter attack on an alien carrier with and agianst aliens:

While the aliens certainly tried their best i was just deadly prepared for it. But you should be able to see that the aliens try to pick a good opportunity for a counter attack, while still not committing everything, so their behaviour cant be exploited, but can still catch you offguard if you have even the tiniest bit of hole in your defense.

SECONDLY ! X-Division doesnt have aliens which run or hide in the last corner of the map. They have a goal, which is to destroy you, and they try their best to achieve that in a group fashion. Again, this is all due to our AI programmer @drages. I also give input if im not satisfied with the AI.
Ofcourse if their numbers get low they get a bit demotivated to play ultra aggressive, but that would the optimal behaviour anyway. They will always try to find a good angle to shoot at you though.

Here is an example with only a low amount of units:

 

@Pave You may be right, and in your playing style as well. I have played the ultimate game where we addressed all these issues for so long, that i may not be up to date to vanilla/XCE flaws anymore.

 

2 hours ago, Pave said:

It's gonna be very interesting to see how well the full-3D-models will eventually enable the environmental-destruction in the second Xenonauts-game (or at the minimum I want to be able to walk on the dropships and UFOs again).

Thats possible right now, and fire in the hole makes top tiles on UFOs destroyable, so there goes your entrance point.

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Hey, I just wanted to say I reinstalled the game by itself, without XCE, and tried starting a Normal campaign. The game is MUCH easier and more playable. Aliens no longer spend the game hiding and camping, and no longer have insane accuracy and reflexes. It's actually manageable now. Here is a post from another user describing exactly the problems I've been having:

 

So it seems that CE actually does make the game a little too hardcore.

Another issue I've been having is with the extra maps. Many of them are full of nooks and crannies for aliens to hide, and because of obstacles, my scout car/tank has a hard time going anywhere. That issue disappeared as well in the vanilla game.

Anyway, it seems pointless to talk about XCE anymore, as it seems the mod is dead/no longer worked on.

X-Division looks interesting on the other hand, I'll likely give it at try once I finish this campaign. :)

Edited by Johnny_B

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