RaccoonTOF Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 This started out with me wanting to add some more regional diversity to ballistic weapons - adding in a full starting suite of Soviet weapons, which then led to adding some European weapons. And then I decided that I wanted to redo even the existing weapons, to base them off of real-world weapons and match the same style of the others. Eventually I want to have a full set of basic ballistic weapons for each of US/Soviet/Euro (pistol, assault rifle, sniper rifle, LMG, shotgun, carbine/SMG) and then an intended later research for "upgraded" versions of them all, for those that want to continue using ballistic weaponry (which will flat replace them in the purchase/equip screens, just as grenades and medpacks auto-upgrade now). Currently I've got a fair number of the weapons created, but thus far I've only got the Dragunov SVD-63 implemented fully in game. My choke point right now is with animations - some of them I can use existing assets with, as due to the small scale in GC, the difference between say, an M16, M4, and G3 are not really noticeable. For others though - particularly the M21, Dragunov, and the SMGs I'm currently working on - none of the existing animations are really a good match. So, I'd like to put a call out for anyone willing to help with these; it's not particularly difficult, and is fairly simple "pixel art" for the most part, but there are a LOT of images to update for each weapon (every angle of every pose and every action taken, with each of the different armor types...). Meanwhile, I'll be finishing up the artwork and XML for at least the first round of regional weapons, plus the batch of restyled laser weapons. Below is what I've got so far (although again, only the Dragunov is fully-implemented in-game thus far, but the rest will be coming soon). Ballistics Revamp Updated Laser Weapons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max_Caine Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 You wil find editing sprites manually to be a frustrating experience, as any particular animation can include upwards of 40+ sprites. However, I look forward to seeing more of your work! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaccoonTOF Posted December 15, 2014 Author Share Posted December 15, 2014 Yup, that's exactly the frustration I was running into and why I was looking for assistance with that if anyone was willing to do so Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash19256 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 I am very interested in this, although I would be unable to help. The weapons definitely look very cool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkExcalibur42 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 The weapons DO look very awesome! If I go ahead with work on a particular mod concept of mine, I may need to ask if I can use one of these variant Laser designs. With all the proper citations and credit of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fall19 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 all the weapons look amazing , but i have to say i like the pistol the most , its just wow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drages Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Nice weapons there. . It's nice to see many ppl try to revamp game weapons. But the usability is important too.. they are many ppl mostly update or work on games first ballistic tier which you use not for a long time in game. You need to give different purposes to weapons.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fall19 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 well then maybe we should use balistics for longer , cant have us figuring out how to design lasers so fast OuO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drages Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 As max said, editing sprite animation nearly impossible. They are all rendered in 3d applications with right light and angle. You need to have the models then animate and put it to game.. auditing sprites one by one at a 2d program will take so long and won't look well. You can play with colors if u want. Fall19, we duplicate lasers from enemy energy weapon. But I like ballistic weapons so I added some to every tier at my mod. But whatever you do, standart ballistic weapons from that times armies would be absolute very soon. some ppl like to see more weapon designs from cold war, some ppl use more futuristic ones. I like updated weapons with more human style weapons. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaccoonTOF Posted December 19, 2014 Author Share Posted December 19, 2014 Totally agreed on the usability, which is why I am adding the advanced ballistics as well. Also, each of the different weapons will have slight variance from the "generic" versions currently in game also, in line with their real-world counterparts (the clip size and round shown in the images above being just one example of this.) In general, ballistics vs energy weapons will do more damage with less accuracy (lasers and advanced ballistics will be roughly equal in overall DPS, and I plan to rescale plasma and mag weapons along similar lines). Plus, ballistics are unlimited in supply (including advanced, once researched), while the rest require manufacturing time and cost. That alone will give a bit of an edge to the advanced ballistics over lasers, to help balance the added in-game value of accuracy trumping sheer damage. As for the sprites - there is no need to edit the actual poses or general appearance, like would be necessary with an armor mod (although the 3d models are provided to us for doing so I believe, I've not looked too closely yet at the models posted here). For the weapons changes though, it is primarily an issue of recoloring stocks and adding/removing scopes from the current assets, which can be done manually fairly easy for a SINGLE image, as it is only a few pixels that need changing in most cases. The main reason it is such an issue is because of the sheer number of individual images that need changing - a few dozen images for a single short animation, such as firing...from a crouch...wearing basic armor. Repeat for each possible combination of weapon, armor, pose...it's just a LOT of small changes to make - and if possible I'd like to spend my time working on the larger-detail images and the stat balancing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drages Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Racoon.. as i am working similar project as you, i can give you some friendly advises, i hope u dont get me wrong.. 1. As soldier sprites, there was Max's project to add different armor and making sprites for it with using 3d models.. as i follow that topic, he got so many problems and need to quit.. or pause for now.. so after some play, you dont realy see that difference.. i mean 1 mm longer rifle wont get anybodies attention maybe after first check.. Another thing is the sprites takes so much place as memory.. i rearmed the aliens with new weapons and i wanted to change the alien plasma guns color red to white.. i did it but when i try to implement to game it took nearly 1 gb alone... As short, give your efford other things and as "last" thing, work on those sprites.. 2. The biggest different between energy and ballistics is "damage type".. you need to understand good to make different purpose weapons.. if you work on aliens resistances, you can make 2x weapon types.. If you dont touch to aliens, all your weapons will act same as damage.. dont miss this opportunity.. I know my english is pain to read but check my discussion thread at my signature.. i try to explain this idea much more detailed there.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaccoonTOF Posted December 19, 2014 Author Share Posted December 19, 2014 Yup, already planned on tweaking the damage types when I got to the plasma/mag rebalance (and was looking into the need to add/alter alien armor to add proper resistances to them as well). But even without changing the base damage type, there is a lot of differentiation that can be done with RoF (by tweaking TU costs and by altering burst sizes), accuracy, dmg per round, clip sizes, reaction modifiers, range, etc. For example, all of the "suppressed" ballistic weapons will have a slight reaction modifier bonus to them (best I could do to simulate the advantages of a silencer), while having a slightly lower max range and in some cases a mild accuracy penalty (not all suppressors decrease accuracy within their operating range, but they DO all have max range penalties - at least all of the weapons I'm including with them...in the real world, they would be firing subsonic ammunition, but I'm not going to be quite so nitpicky as to require using different ammo, I'm adding enough new ammo types already). The general idea is to have all of the weapons work "generally" like the do in the vanilla game, but with minor variations between sub-types, and to give each "tier" a definite niche that it is best at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkExcalibur42 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 (edited) This thread got me thinking along some new lines.... and reminded me of Falling Skies. If only we could code research-unlocked ammunition upgrades, like what happens with grenades and rockets where the new model replaces the old, then we could research Alien Alloy Munitions for ballistic weapons which could put starting ballistics on par with laser weapons... Edited December 19, 2014 by DarkExcalibur42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drages Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Just the vanilla didnt use the damage types and you just use better weapons for more damage.. I didnt know there is a damage type differences at game before i start modding.. but if you dont use the enemy resistances, you will always stick to same weapons.. For example: Just think that there is no damage differences and resistances in game.. You made many weapons with RoF.. but i would choose the best damage weapon with moderate accuracity.. if i can kill the enemy with this weapon, who cares surpression, 1-2 range differences, reactions.. so give me 2 sniper 2 shotgun and others rifle.. even i want to use another weapon, it would be just to check them... But if you give different resistances to enemies.. even your best rifle can be useless at some situvations.. Anyway, i will wait your mod! good luck and much patience to you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drages Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 This thread got me thinking along some new lines.... and reminded me of Fallen Skies.If only we could code research-unlocked ammunition upgrades, like what happens with grenades and rockets where the new model replaces the old, then we could research Alien Alloy rounds for ballistic weapons which could put starting ballistics on par with laser weapons... You can do it.. just you will make "same weapon" per new ammo.. and when you want to update the ammo, you will make the game update the weapon as well.. You will use the same pictures and same string name.. no one will know the weapon changed and you will have same weapon with updated ammo.. Wow.. this idea came to me now.. lol.. why didnt i use this.. fck.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkExcalibur42 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Just the vanilla didnt use the damage types and you just use better weapons for more damage.. I didnt know there is a damage type differences at game before i start modding.. but if you dont use the enemy resistances, you will always stick to same weapons..For example: Just think that there is no damage differences and resistances in game.. You made many weapons with RoF.. but i would choose the best damage weapon with moderate accuracity.. if i can kill the enemy with this weapon, who cares surpression, 1-2 range differences, reactions.. so give me 2 sniper 2 shotgun and others rifle.. even i want to use another weapon, it would be just to check them... But if you give different resistances to enemies.. even your best rifle can be useless at some situvations.. Anyway, i will wait your mod! good luck and much patience to you Yeah.... if we had a way to upgrade ballistics, then downgraded MAG weaponry we could make a 3-tier system: Starting Ballistics Alloy Munitions / Laser Weapons Plasma / MAG weapons Ohhh.... oh yeah. I like this a lot. I'm stealing this for when I rebalance weapons and alien armor values. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkExcalibur42 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 You can do it.. just you will make "same weapon" per new ammo.. and when you want to update the ammo, you will make the game update the weapon as well.. You will use the same pictures and same string name.. no one will know the weapon changed and you will have same weapon with updated ammo..Wow.. this idea came to me now.. lol.. why didnt i use this.. fck.. WAIT.... you can do that?! I thought there were all sorts of posts on the modding boards about how we couldn't get multiple ammo types to be used by the same weapon... except for rocket launchers for some reason. Now I'm confused, because I don't see how it works in the xmls. I was just comparing rocket weapons in the weapons_gc.xml to ballistic weapons, and it looks like all that happens is they have multiple ammo types listed. So next I'm looking through the strings.xml and weapons.xml, but i need to download Libre Office to make these tables easier to read. Where is this that you tell the game to replace an old ammo type with a new one? I'm fascinated now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkExcalibur42 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 (edited) This? ReplaceItem("weapon.grenade.frag","weapon.grenade.alenium"); Found it in the researches.xml, though I don't think I yet properly understand the context and how to place it into the file appropriately. Edited December 19, 2014 by DarkExcalibur42 typed strings.xml instead of research Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drages Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 This?ReplaceItem("weapon.grenade.frag","weapon.grenade.alenium"); Found it in the strings.xml, though I don't think I yet properly understand the context and how to place it into the file appropriately. At research.xml you will see that replace code.. it means when u finished that research, x will become y.. So i dont talk about multiple ammos here.. a weapon cant use 2 ammo type.. so for this reason you cant replace x ammo to y ammo.. but you can replace "a" weapon with "x" ammo to "b" weapon with "y" ammo... if you make "a"weapon and "b" weapon same, you will have "a" weapon with "y" ammo... For example.. you got ballistic rifle with standart magazine.. you make another weapon with same pictures and stats (you can change picture and stats too ofcourse so u update not only ammo but weapon too) and make a "alienallowmagazine".. then you add a replace code to alienallow research.. u replace only weapons.. then when u researched alienallow you have a same looking same named (at string.xml.. string.xml is using only giving names to objects in game.. weapon.nucmiss.rocket = Nuclear Missile for exm..) rifle but with alienallow ammo.. the player wont notice the weapon changed.. he will see only changed ammo... oki? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkExcalibur42 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 So i dont talk about multiple ammos here.. a weapon cant use 2 ammo type.. But that's exactly what the rocket launcher does... it uses 2 ammo types. AND it uses ammo that auto upgrades on research. so for this reason you cant replace x ammo to y ammo.. but you can replace "a" weapon with "x" ammo to "b" weapon with "y" ammo... if you make "a"weapon and "b" weapon same, you will have "a" weapon with "y" ammo... Well this will definitely work, no question about that. But I think I'm going to play with the code and test to see if i can upgrade just the ammo. It'd save time and make the final mod smaller. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drages Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 But that's exactly what the rocket launcher does... it uses 2 ammo types. AND it uses ammo that auto upgrades on research.Well this will definitely work, no question about that. But I think I'm going to play with the code and test to see if i can upgrade just the ammo. It'd save time and make the final mod smaller. Yes only rockets and launchers do that. It's coded only for rocket types. You can add rockets to a launcher but you can't add ammo to a non launcher weapon. Because the rockets are not ammo they are weapons too. U can't add more ammo to a weapon at weapon.xml . I tried and asked it but just stuck.. u can't replace ammo only because ammo stats are at weapon coding. If u use my method you only add 10 lines more to game code. But try your ideas.. maybe u catch something we miss... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkExcalibur42 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 I forgot about the weapons.xml file. I was just looking at the weapons_gc.xml file where ammo types are listed, since the weapons.xml only deals with stuff at the base I thought... I'll report back and let you know what I break. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkExcalibur42 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 u can't replace ammo only because ammo stats are at weapon coding. If u use my method you only add 10 lines more to game code. But try your ideas.. maybe u catch something we miss... You're right. For some reason I was thinking I'd need to make copies of art assets for some reason... now I can't remember why I thought that was necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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