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True. Just feels odd that a rifle starts it's drop around the length of a building though. Not complaining. Just saying. It's tolerable in a game. Anyways, read the bottom half of the post. What do you think of the random icons in fog of war idea? Or post an idea of your own. Much more likely to see some changes if you post some suggestions for solutions to your request instead of leaving them to their own devices. And more likely to get something you may actually like. Follow? I'm honestly ok with the way things are if they added more cover. Was just trying to figure something out that the masses may like too. You know, something that could easily be done without taking up too much of their time.

Been racking my brain about a solution for this for awhile. Trying to figure out what would fix it without feeling too unrealistic. Maybe that's why I can't think of anything that would work and feel well. Trying to keep some realism in projectile physics in a video game is just lolz. Maps are just too small to support any realism with drop-off rates. Almost all of those weapons in a realistic world setting WOULD be able to shoot across these little maps and be fairly accurately with little to no drop-off. And soldiers LOS would be be even further than the entire map. So screw realism. This is the only thing I could come up with but I can see how it could still be somewhat abused. Although it would still be much better than what it currently is: Not allowing full vision of forward troop-sited enemies from rear troops by using fog of war and some kind of "cloned" enemy image when the rear troop is your active one. For instance, a forward troop has an enemy sited but when you select your rear sniper it applies fog of war again for the sniper's normal vision and range, BUT 3+(dependent on range to sniper) enemy icons show in the general area in the fog of war representing imperfect accuracy(or guessing) vs enemies he can't actually see. You could target and shoot at any one of these icons as if they where all enemies and If you get lucky, you could still hit and kill it. But it would add somewhat of a guessing game and the decision of weather or not to waste ammo at all comes into play. I for one, have no problem with the enemy using the current squad site. Vs a human they need any help they can get. The problem is, they will sometimes shoot at our troops even without having ANY visuals at all on us. At times, they seem to just randomly shoot at anyone on the map which just feels cheep(especially true in enemy bases). This would be fine IF they weren't so accurate with their shots so it felt like a guess rather than AI cheese. Maybe this is supposed feel like they have cameras up in their bases all over the place? Even so, it's not cool

Agree with you. Some maps really are just a snipe fest(not enough cover to flank like you said). I never thought about the range being the problem until you mentioned it. Honestly, I started using the hunter for cover moving forward but that only works for a few turns if your lucky. I've officially given up on this last build though. Don't think I even got to lasers before it got crash happy so I wouldn't know ether if they changed it. Hard to tell how bad it is on the first weapons because their damage is already quite low. Here's to hoping the next build is a stable one.

Like I said, my game is modified in so many areas.... Not even sure what the accuracy penalty for moving and shooting in the same turn with heavies is. It must be awfully large though. Entirely possible that we play snipers differently to. I move often with mine so I'm always cover to cover with just enough AP's to fire 1-2 pistol rounds and no snipe rounds. Maybe 1-2 low damage shots isn't worth the time to some. Is for me though, sense it's saved my troops more times than I can remember. Aliens have a much larger advantage than normal in my config file so I need every bit of help I can get .

Ah, I see what you're saying now. Sounds like we just need better AI opponents honestly. Instead of aliens that hide miles away like little girls. See that's what happens when people whine about blind firing aliens... they don't do shit now when they could be squad siting just like our troops instead of sitting there like dip shits. You're saying you want a more extreme penalties for shooting outside the weapons range right? I could get on board with that sense the aliens AI is such a puss at the moment. Should be an awfully simple change for them I would think.

Sorry I'm not the best at explaining things. What I meant with pistols still being a viable backup weapon for heavies is simply TU costs. The larger weapons take so many TUs to fire that they leave you almost completely vulnerable if you move at all because you can't move and fire effectively. This is where the pistols come in. If that makes sense at all. Not very good at explaining myself. But it feels pretty good if you try it out. Granted I'm using those numbers on a highly modified game where everything is rebalanced according to weight, projectile speed(lead times), and general weapon types. General idea behind what I did with my weapon stats: Weight controls aiming times, burst fire accuracy, and reloading time(to some extent). Projectile speed controls, general accuracy(relates to how hard it is to lead targets), and mitigation values. Weight and Projectile speeds I figured had less to do with weapon types and more to do with the effects on our troops using them. Which seems to work well for a benchmark to work off of that helps keep some balance between the weapon types. Unfortunately, you can probably guess that trying to completely balance weapons with some "formula" doesn't always work. You'll still need to fine tune weapons with some trial and error in the field. In all honesty though, weapon balance really doesn't make much difference because they made the game so easy to mod. I'm just hoping they release a fairly stable game so modders have a good platform to work from. A few months after release, I'm sure there will be plenty of "re-balance" mods for everyone's tastes. As far as the accuracy formula goes, I think it's fine where it is. They just need to explain, in depth, how it works. The more complicated it gets, the harder it will be for people to mod or even understand. I'll try to explain it real quickly but it may just makes things worse lol. OK this is all based on a perfect 100 accuracy soldier, on open ground, with perfect unhindered vision(nothing altering vision like smoke or objects). In your weapons_gc.xml you'll see a "props range" which would be better described as "Optimal Range". Props range refers to the range at which a particular weapon's accuracy and damage will start to decline when fired beyond(this has no correlation with your soldier's stats). Still with me? Hope so. Let's use the basic pistol for reference. I can't remember what the default pistol values are so I'll just post my current ones. <Weapon name="weapon.pistol" bulletType="normal" emptySound="Empty Click 1"> <props range="16" hands="1" recoil="0" weight="2" isHeavy="0" clipSize="12" reloadAPCost="20" reloadSound="Weapon Pistol Reload" reactionModifier="1.75" hpLimit="60" /> <SingleShot sound="Weapon Pistol Single" delay="0.6" suppressionValue="9" suppressionRadius="1"> <Set1 ap="11" accuracy="40" /> <Set2 ap="21" accuracy="60" /> <Set3 ap="31" accuracy="80" /> </SingleShot> <GUIImage name="gui/weapons/pistol" /> <GroundImage name="grounditemimages/pistol.png"/> <Ammos> <Ammo name="ammo.ballistic.pistol" type="kinetic" damage="15" mitigation="5"> <Projectile spectre="projectiles/bullet/bullet" speed="800"/> Now lets go through a few of those values and how they effect accuracy and work in combat: props range="16" (The optimal range at which the weapon can fire without loosing accuracy or damage. Read below for more on how this relates to actual accuracy values.) <Set1 ap="11" accuracy="40" /> (This value relates to the first "step" of aiming time if you fire the weapon with the lowest amount of TUs used. 11 TUs in this case, plus any additional movement time added on. In relation to "props range", you will have a 40% chance to hit an unobstructed target at 16 tiles(the weapon's props range or "Optimal Range") with a soldier possessing a perfect 100 accuracy stat. If your troop is firing beyond 16 tiles in range, the accuracy will decline in amounts relative to the actual distance past 16 tiles the target is. Beyond your soldier's control) <Set2 ap="21" accuracy="60" /> (The second step in accuracy which takes a few more TUs) <Set3 ap="31" accuracy="80" /> (The final step which uses the most TUs to fire but has the best chance to hit. Note; the default game doesn't have a third aiming value for pistols so you likely won't see this in your xml unless you've added it.) damage="15" (The damage value shows the "raw" damage of the weapon(before any armor or mitigation) that will be done to the target as long as your troop is not beyond the props range value. In this case 16 tiles. If your troop is firing beyond 16 tiles in range, the damage value is then lower the farther out the target is.) Anyways, hopefully this is a bit easier to understand... wordy as hell I know. There are more variables at work here like crouch vs prone but this should be enough to start modding weapons to your liking. Also, the reason you never see the accuracy values in the xml in actual combat is simply that they are all based on a 100% accuracy soldier. So you will usually see around 50-60 percent of these values with your starting troops. Needless to say, your soldiers can become quite god-like IF they survive enough battles.

Ahh, maybe that's the problem. Can't remember if I was only one tile behind or maybe 2-3. It always showed 100% to hit the guy in front. Although I've modded the accuracy on weapons so much that maybe that screwed with it somehow. Thanks guys. I'll pay more attention next time when the new version gets released. Hopefully a more "stable version". Given up tell then. The terrain levels I was talking about was just when exiting the drop ship(ramp). Although, there are so many graphical oddities that it almost seems there are different "levels", especially on the farm maps with all the screwy hedgerows.

Post your funny xenonaut moments here so we can all get a good laugh Here's one of mine from a few weeks ago. AI turn: Farmer runs behind one of my 3 remaining solders. Farmer shoots at alien in fog of war. Soldier Hit 1 soldier kia Player turn: Soldiers move behind a tractor far away from insane farmer. Soldier fires multiple shots at alien, which is now in sight, with a pistol. Miss Miss Miss AI turn: Alien moves to tractor adjacent soldiers and fires a plasma pistol burst at farmer. Miss Farmer runs behind 1 of two remain solders and hides in fear for his life. Player turn: Soldier fires Rocket at Alien. Tractor Hit 2 soldiers kia, Insane farmer kia. Alien wins

Really isn't as bad as you guys may think. Strength = Increases when you are incumbered and you take any action(movement while carrying extreme weight increases your strength. Sensible right?) Accuracy = Increases when you fire your weapons(Although it should be when you actually hit something) Reflexes = Increases when your soldier gets a reaction shot(Based entirely on your soldier's starting reflex percentage and the weapon he/she is using). AP = Increases with anything you do but at quite a low rate. Bravery = Increases each time your soldier panics(Backwards if you think about it) Resilience = This I'm not completely sure on. One of two things raise this. It ether increases slowly as your soldier takes damage or it is simply increased when your soldier ranks up. A few of them are a bit odd like bravery but none are really game-breaking considering you can change the rates in the config to your liking.

My soldiers are just giant magnets is all. All bullets just change trajectories mid-flight and head straight for them hehe. Joking of course, although it does feel like that at times lolz.

Very odd, because I've yet to be able to shoot(while standing) over a crouching troop. No joke. Unless you guys are talking about the troop standing is actually on higher ground or something? We must be talking about two different games or I'm in the twilight zone lol.

Simple fix to keep the balance is to work with the props range and AP's usage. It really isn't so bad the way they have it. What I did with mine was simply increasing AP costs on weapons like the Sniper, Rocket Launcher, and MG's. If it takes nearly an entire turn to fire at max accuracy with a sniper, very seldom will you use it in close range engagements. As long as the sniper doesn't kill in one turn, this works well. I actually raised my AP costs to the point where rookie soldiers may not even be able to use the last "focused" shot and will need to increase their AP count first. There is a fine line between balance and just plain annoying though. We don't want it to feel like the player's options are too limited. Obviously when your soldiers grow to the point where they have 70+ in AP you don't want them to still feel like a rookie. So just be careful how much you raise or lower things. For example, this is what my numbers look like for the ballistic sniper(although this is on a heavily modified version of the game). props range="33" <Set1 ap="36" accuracy="60" /> <Set2 ap="46" accuracy="80" /> <Set3 ap="56" accuracy="100" /> Granted, I'm still fiddling around with the balance in mine so I may even make it more expensive to fire heavies eventually. Although you don't have much for a low AP cost shot, it does feel bad ass like a sniper should at range. And with these high costs, it gives a real incentive to take a pistol along for the random close encounters. The best part though, is that(along with the heavy weapon strength movement penalty) it keeps people from bringing NOTHING but snipers or MGs only. Well, at least until their soldiers are all godly vets.

Gotta be flipping kidding me! Bahahahahaha. Didn't even think about trying that. Thanks so much Caine! This thread can be deleted now haha Note: Are you sure about this though? I don't seem to recall any stages beyond just one in the xml. I'll give it a try though. Hope you are right Although, I'm pretty sure the "odd AP results" you're referring to is just movement additions, arm lift AP(don't think this is even used), rotation AP, and stand/kneel AP. They all add additional time to the overall AP used for healing.

True, there is cover shooting but it's fairly broken and inconsistent. Can't shoot over kneeling troops in front of standing troops (but it does safely work for reaction firing. reasoning?). The percentage to "HIT" your own cover and therefore destroy it is just laughable and not needed. Although it's like this for aliens to, it just isn't needed. Aliens have a hard enough time the way it is, the IA scripting doesn't seem to have aliens stand and fire behind cover at all. So they just destroy their own cover constantly. Not to mention, they are always shooting each other in the back which is another topic entirely lol. Think about it though, these are aliens vs soldiers, not kids playing cowboys and Indians. Just how bad of a shot are these so called leet soldiers and aliens that they can't shoot over their own cover? And to be fair, this game, at it's worst, in unfinished state, is better than Firaxis's so-called remake as far as strategy games go. Hardly even a shadow of the original X-COM's. It shouldn't even have the same name. A watered down, incredibly linier, trivialized mess. The only difficulty relied on overly accurate and overpowered aliens with random one shotting of your squad members. More like a board game just rolling the dice than a strategy game.

Just a simple adjustment I'm sure. Please oh please oh please increase the damage healed per activation. I'd just mod it in myself but I honestly gave up trying to figure out how it's working in the script. Always getting odd results. It gets extremely old clicking medkit, then soldier which needs healing, then waiting for animations to finish, and again and again and again. Takes literally 20 mouse clicks just to heal one heavily wounded soldier atm. By no means am I saying I want them cheaper to use, only faster. Pretty please with sexy on top