Aufklarer
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Posts posted by Aufklarer
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Government issues warning to civilians... stay clear of crash sites as they are dangerous.
Risk of civilian casualties on an airstrike becomes less important than killing aliens, remember the context that this game is set in... its not a war, its not even a world war (by our standards) its resistance against humanities very extinction on a global scale. No price can be put on the survival of our species and the planet as a whole. If bombing the alien crash sites denies them recovering assets and fighting troops then I see no reason why any funding nation would hold back.
5 civilian casualties in an air strike amongst a war where the aliens are slaughtering thousands by the hour is nothing.
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More problematic, however, is that once you're a few months into the game you can get both materials and experience from *smaller* UFOs with practically no risk. The airstrike option, therefore, seems like it would be optimally deployed on the larger, more dangerous UFOs while smaller ones (along with alien bases) provide experience and resources. The airstrike option, therefore, seems to me to incentivise playing the least interesting missions because there's much less risk relative to the rewards you can get.
I'm happy to be proven wrong, mind. But that's what I'd expect on paper, at least.
The fact that it remains optional to use means that you, and other like minded people can still play without the airstrike option ever even being used. Your point while being valid is very situational. Not everyone will use the airstrike and prefer instead to play as the original x-com was intended. I'm glad I'm not forced down any particular path and have the option to choose is great. Air striking is way more preferable than leaving a crash site to expire.
The very fact we have options makes what is already a great strategy game even more multi faceted.
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Sounds like a reasonable compromise, I really like the advisor option discussed earlier in the thread.
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Mytheos has a good point. The small UFOs popping up throughout the game are there to allow training of rookies, for the most part. How about we incorporate training rookies into the local forces bit so we don't have to do the tedious rookie-training-missions over and over again and so we can focus on the fun stuff; using already trained soldiers to take out aliens using high-tech weapons.
Under my idea, we'd have three options available to deal with crash sites (short of simply ignoring them):
a) Do the Ground Combat Normally
Same benefits as we currently have: artifacts, soldier stat increases, relationship bonus, research materials, etc.
b) Offer Crashsite to Local Forces
You can give the crash site to the local forces to let them handle it themselves.
This you a relationship boost because they get all of the artifacts, the research materials, etc.
c) Assist Local Forces
You can give the crash site to the local forces and send a dropship of soldiers to the site.
This gives you a higher relationship boost and increases the skills of the soldiers used, provided they have low stats. However, the soldiers also are unavailable for 6 (?) hours as they assist the local forces. There also could be a chance for the soldiers to be wounded or killed.
Involving Stats: If the soldier's have stats under 65 (?) then there would be a chance (I'm thinking 75%) that they would gain one skill point in that sub-65 stat. Once they hit 65 in that stat they cannot increase it by assisting local forces anymore. However, even if your soldiers aren't getting stat-ups, you still get a higher relationship boost than if using the normal "Offer Crash Site to Local Forces" option because you're giving them more (rights to artifacts vs rights to artifacts and assistance in getting them).
Involving Being Wounded: maybe 30% chance for light wounds, 10% chance for heavy wounds, 1% chance of death, otherwise 59% chance they don't take any damage.
How to incorporate into the game, as far as the UI goes:
When you click on the crash site in the geoscape and the little menu pops up, simply give another option (besides intercept/send forces) "Offer Crash Site to Local Forces". This produces option (b) above.
When you send a dropship of soldiers, and the "Begin Mission" prompt comes up, there could be another option there as well, "Assist Local Forces" which produces option © above.
Restrictions to Local Force Involvement
The local forces shouldn't be allowed to handle a UFO before you have done at least three (?) ground missions with that UFO type.
This is for several reasons:
a) You need to have an opportunity to get research materials, and if you decide not to do a crash site and simply let the local forces do it you may miss out on important datacores and other materials required for progressing.
b) You should have the opportunity to experience every awesome UFO the devs have worked on; it's only fair to them.
c) As far as lore goes, the Local Forces aren't going to assault the UFO blind like the Xenonauts do. They need interior maps, after-action reports, and reconnaissance on the enemy. Thus, once you've done three, say, corvettes, you've gathered enough intel to sufficiently brief the local forces on how to take corvettes and what to expect, and only then are they ready and willing to take the crash site themselves.
d) You shouldn't be a slacker and simply never do any missions. By forcing the player to do at least 3 missions of each UFO type you know for a fact that they will have at least three encounters with each type of UFO. This knowledge will be invaluable for balancing, I'm sure.
Important Note Concerning Relationships:
The relationship boost of doing a ground mission yourself should not be negligible. You should be able to play and win the game by doing every single crash site yourself. You shouldn't be penalized by taking the long way 'round, as it were, and having the Xenonauts never delegate their responsibilities, if you can successfully do that. Because you would be selling loot and getting more materials you wouldn't need to rely on the funding as much, so we can make the relationship boost from doing it yourself smaller than if you gave the mission to the local forces. However, it can't be too small a boost, otherwise it'd penalize the guys who want to do every mission.
Suggestion:
In the UFO reports that the science division gives the player, why not have the scientist suggest that you leave the smaller crash sites alone, and focus on the larger, more dangerous, more important ones. After all, the local forces can handle it.
EDIT: EchoFourDelta Had a Good Idea:
We'll use a light scout for an example here, though it applies to all UFOs:
We have to do light scout ground missions ourselves three times to unlock Assist Local Forces. After we Assist three times we unlock Offer Crash Site to Local Forces. This way we kind of teach the local forces how to take care of the sites themselves. Brilliant idea, E4D.
I agree with everything in this post, I think it would make the game much more interesting and remove some of the tedious UFO grinding. It also seems a much better compromise to achieve the desired results than anything else mentioned. For those that state it's akin to auto resolve, how about making this feature controllable via the options menu such as IRONMAN mode currently is. Some people will inevitably prefer the game to remain as close to the original as possible. Too many other versions of the x-com remakes strayed to far from the original formula. I don't see this idea as doing that but by giving people the choice will only serve to please everyone.
I have no idea how much work would be required to make this happen but If I could help out in any way I would be more than happy to.
Chris comment please I believe this is a very plausible solution
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They should block line of sight and restrict firing... the whole idea of smoke grenades are to allow freedom of movement on the battlefield and on occasion provide deception.
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Sorry for the late reply I have been really busy with the incoming guys from the UK we are handing over to, Ill be coming home in about 3 weeks or so. I have everything saved as PSD files and PNG files. Ill fiddle about with the PPI, it's been about 6 years since I last used photoshop for stuff and I have lost alot of the knowledge I had. Cheers for the pointers Jsleezy i'll take a look when i next have some spare time.
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I have been saving them as Png files
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Concerning radar guided stuff;
Apparently the UFOs are basically radar invisible and so a super long ranged missile wouldn't work.
Except that we can detect and track them from hundreds of miles away. With, you know... radar.Game... set... match... E4D
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Ill add letters in the next update then, which will probably be when the mag weapons are done in 3D also. Ill use the role names as opposed to the weapon names. If there is anything else you'd like to see please let me know.
Jsleezy I know your pretty handy with graphics, is there any way to increase the resolution that photoshop works to. The images im creating are limited to detail by the resolution at the moment?
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ill try and dig out some videos of some charges i have set off and put them in my drop box you guys can see the effects of proper cutting charges
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If you're talking about putting a hole a human can go through in normal structural materials (i.e. not solid metal) and that aren't doors this can be accomplished with what amounts to a series of small line charges using specially-shaped explosive packages that impart a directional cutting effect through the material, and (if the initial detonation didn't result in a clean "cut") followed on with a secondary general-purpose detonation that finishes demolishing the "cut-out" from the rest of the wall.
Using sufficient amounts of C4 (in the form it's issued) can knock a hole in the wall, just like you want, but the result is going to be much less controlled, simply due to the nature of how explosives behave when they're detonated while attached to or resting on a surface: most of their energy blows out and away from the surface. This has to be focused mechanically, usually by shaping the explosive material in a particular manner and affixing backing materials that force the desired blast pattern, resulting in what's called a linear shaped charge. Multiple charges like this are affixed to the wall to be breached, and detonated.
Another option is to slam a SMAW round into the wall; that usually knocks a hole in large enough for a person to climb through.
Everything E4D says here is true, the key to it is precision explosives with directional cutting charges. A lump of explosive would create a hole but It would be anything but precise, not to mention dangerous to anyone nearby. As he says normal explosives would need to be placed against a wall with packing material behind it. When the explosives detonate there is little resistance behind the explosives (away from the wall) there is just air. The main force of the blast is projected away from the wall (not entirely). By backing the explosives with wooden frames for example increases the explosion force of the charge. Its a crude way of making it directional.
Purpose built breaching charges are designed in strips to place along the desired cutting line, or hinges of doors, and cut with a shaped metal iner which is formed upon detonation
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I never even noticed the inconsistencies, I was too busy killing aliens!
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Yeah I know what you mean, I'm hoping its something that they intend on refining closer to the games end. The same image file is used and magnified. Also the scroll bar to cycle through the images is the same. There Isn't any reason why they can't display them in the same resolution as they are displayed on the soldier screen. The whole role change and setting of default load outs needs to be redone to be honest as it isn't the most intuitive. I can imagine it's a tidying up issue rather than part of chris's main focus right now.
Ill look over the 2D Images and remove the glow effect as I have for most of them already, the ones I haven't done are probably either an oversight, or the additional and ranks which I haven't had the chance to look at yet. I had only knocked together the 2D ones pretty quickly anyway, I intend to improve the quality of those at a later date as there are plenty of 2D ones around. Its a work in progress. I will add in the letters when I get some time as you suggest. I was going to concentrate mostly on the 3D ones for now but it seems a few people prefer the 2D icons so I will look at modifying those.
P - Pistol
R - Rifle
S - Shotgun
G - Gunner or H - Heavy
M - Missile or RL - Rocket Launcher
S - Sniper or M - Marksman
There are a couple of role letter conflicts there, any ideas?
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Most confusing post of my life
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let the locals beat them to death with sticks, god help them if they crash anywhere near egypt...
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I liked in the original that a damaged UFO could be entered from its damaged sides, it also made the approach to breaching a UFO more tricky. Modular UFO's should have been the way to go from the start, I'd rather have the option of multiple levels and destructable walls than a pretty looking image.
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Point blank machine gun. Perfect to make short work out of soon to be small holes.
In films yeah in reality not so much
I'm a combat engineer and deal with breaching charges, and demolitions for all situations (bridges - Bangalore torpedoes - mouse hole charges) I have even breached compounds in Afghanistan using half bar mines so my reference to my comments is me
seriously though I can give dems calculations etc for anyone serious about creating an accurate mod. Notwithstanding the good work people have already done to create breaching charges. -
Are you going to do color stripes for the other two tiers of weapons?
Why do both you and Steel have such good role image packs? I'm forced to choose.
hahaYes I will make both plasma and mag weapons 3D with coloured stripe versions. After they are done I'll go back and work on the 2D roles as they were done fairly quickly to get the 2D pack complete. Ill be adding more additionals in between all of that. I have a few more ideas from people they wanted included.
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IRL, your guys would just rip a smaller piece off their C4 block or use a water charge or both or some det cord pasted to the wall.
Wrong, ripping off a chunk of plastic explosive doesn't make it directional (which is what you want). Standing next to even a fist size of PE4 will hurt you big time. Where as a purpose built breaching charge allows for much closer proximity. Additionally det cord will not breach a wall alone, it would struggle to cleanly breach a wooden fence panel, its use is to link the explosives together if you have multiple charges and connect the detonator(s) (placed in the explosive)
We need this in game, It opens up a whole new dimension to the tactics available to us.
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Updated, download links to follow (internet is playing up out here)
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Try drop box firebeard, get an account and just drop them in the drop box file on your comp, then post up the link. I'd be interested in reading them just because I like guns n shit
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Test procedure:
Needs one shooter and one person on a stopwatch. Several targets - humanoid, or round, or whatever, as long as it's constant through the tests (and roughly the size of something you might want to shoot ... not a billboard) - set up on a safe range preferrably far away from other people or much of anything else. (This could get a little wild, as far as shooting range safety goes... Not exactly "unsafe", but not exactly procedure either.) Start with about 25 paces on the range to targets, retest at 50 if time and ammo allow.
Remarkably I do this on a monthly basis as part of my weapon handling tests here in Afghanistan. While I am unable to be in a position to record timings I can offer you generalised results of a few scenarios in the setting you described. I have done 5 of these monthly ranges with 1 more to be completed next month (september) before i return home.
Weapon: SA80 A2 5.56mm single shot 30 rnds
Standing with the target to my left 90' at a range of 25 meters using the laser dot battle sight on my ACOG I can accurately and consistently hit the center of mass of a figure 11 target (full sized man) within 3 seconds of the whistle blast. One round is fired each whistle blast and then we reset with the target 90' to the left. I usually group my hits slightly higher than center of mass (which ends up sternum - neck area) with an approximate 12 inch grouping.
This practice is then repeated with the target to the right at 90* and also again behind at 180'
At reduced range 5 meters each time the grouping is reduced approx 3-4 inches per 5 meters and the time taken to aim and fire is slightly quicker.
We also do cadence shooting which is essentially firing rapidly while walking towards the target. Depending on the cadence stated in the practice detail we fire either 1 round per 2 seconds, 1 round per second or 2 rounds per second. To be honest we don't do enough of it to become competent and I would approximate starting from 25 meters and advancing to 5 using 30 rounds I generally hit around 75% of my shots on target, and that could be anywhere from knees to head.
With regards to generalised firing we use 1 round per 6 seconds for aimed shots and 1 round per 2 seconds for rapid fire as a general rule. Typically at 100 meters in the kneeling position, with a zero'd weapon I don't miss a target, at standing out of 20 rounds ill miss maybe 2-4.
With the GPMG I can't give you any advice as for safety reasons we can't use them on 25 meter ranges and we also never fire from the standing or kneeling position due to the fact its woefully inaccurate. Keeping a full 3-5 round burst on target at 100 meters prone is hard enough due to recoil. Realistically the first 2 rounds are accurate the rest fall close enough to the target to cause effect (ie get them supressed). Burst are kept between 3-5 rounds every couple of seconds. barrels changed around the 800-1000 rounds fired mark.
LMG such as Minimi are a different story, but they are 5.56mm calibre and are more accurate.
Obviously these are firing under controlled conditions and noone else is shooting back at me, also I regard my self to be above average in marksmanship. Im a combat engineer and not special forces as I'd like to hope the xenonauts are.
Hope this information helps however I wont be able to do any formal testing, British run ranges are very strict and rigidly run, however the americans I have noticed have a very lax attitude on ranges and may therefore have more scope to be able to run informal test such as those you describe.
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I'm all for realism mods, it seems most of what we all say is derailing the intention of the mod developers. Again I think the focus should remain on what can be done within the constraints of the game. While Im sure what your saying is accurate to your own experiances none of what you have said really has any relevance. The game dosn't cater for weapon stoppages or barrel changes, nor are the weapons being used in game above and beyond normal combat stress.
The issue with the machine guns from at least my view (and asked if it could be addressed) was that the rate of fire in one game turn dosnt accurately depict the rate of fire a gunner would use to supress an enemy.
The point Ron made about the weapons heating up is valid enough and rounds do occasionally cook off (admittedly rarely due to the rate of fire being excessive) although I think the majority are due to a defucnt round rather than the weapon itself. Last year in BATUS (Canada) a Cpl in my unit manning his GPMG had a breach explosion because he followed incorrect drills during a stoppage (He lifted the feed tray exposing the chamber to cooler air during an obstruction clearance). Again though this has little relevance to the game mod.
I think the mod developers are doing a decent job and the general characteristics of the weapon need to be modded not the intricacies which are being discussed here.
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Whatever floats your boat
[UI] Aufklarer's Soldier Role Images
in Modding Discussion
Posted
I have 3 days until I leave afghanistan so its mega busy here with the handover and I haven't had the time to continue with the project at the moment. I will add you request to the list and produce a couple of icons in the next release. When I go on leave i'll be able to devote a bit of time to finishing off the mag weapons I have started.