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  1. I need to quote the manual: That suggests that a soldier can gain 2 points in each attibute per battle. But I have not been able to make any soldeir gain more than +1 to STR, ACC or RFL (TUs are very easy to gain). Has anyone been able to train any skill other than TU and BRV at +2 per mission? And if so, what are the thresholds? For instance, you only need 1 shot to gain +1 ACC and +1 RFL.
  2. So while I was playing tonight I thought "Hey, why not give the soldiers a medical skill" ... Wouldn't have to be anything special, maybe for every 10 points in the "Medic" skill, you heal an extra 1 Hit Point, And every use of the Med-kit on another soldier would grant a few points xp ... But it would mean I could have my combat medics, and hopefully this wouldn't be too hard to code into the game
  3. I think there is a way to avoid "calisthenics". And they should be avoided. Shooting at walls or doing ridiculous things like "spend 600 AP when loaded to 80%+ weight" should not generate XP/training. No more Bethesda-style Master of Running! I had posted something like that before but it was only a tweak to another system. This here is a complete concept so I put it in a new thread. Any and all XP gains are tied to "hurting an alien". You can't cheese the system and train indefinitely because you run out of aliens. The XP that an alien "contains" is limited and independent from the alien's hit points! This XP pool can be used up before the alien is dead. You can suppress an alien all day long but that's not going to result in training all day long. XP is absolutely limited to the amount of aliens in the area. No alien? Go home. You're done here. More dangerous aliens have a larger XP pool. = another useful balancing tool because you have a way to balance total XP gain! The total amount of "training" that a soldier receives from an action is directly proportional to the percentage of the target's max hit points that the attack subtracts. Hitting an alien tank for 20% of it's damage would be worth 20% of the alien's XP pool. With a very dangerous alien you get more XP for the same action because it has a bigger XP pool. Suppression or stun damage could also generate XP. This XP is all taken from the same pool. If a "heavy" does nothing but suppress lots of aliens without ever damaging one, he has still contributed. He gets XP for that. If you shoot a rocket at a wall, that's the same thing as doing it on a shooting range. No alien hurt. No mission XP. You can also de-couple the XP reward from success at an action. This way a raw recruit shooting at an alien 3 times can get the same result as the veteran hitting the alien 3 times. Instead of the above "XP generation" method, the base chance to hit is calculated. (not dependent on soldier skill!) A low probability shot is worth low XP percentage. The weapon's average damage (minus target's mitigation) multiplies that. The soldier gets rewarded with XP equivalent to the damage that he will probably do. Since these "average XP" can mean that the alien is killed before all it's XP have been "used up", the killing / stunning shot always awards any remaining XP that the alien may have. As described above, lower ranks get an XP bonus so they advance faster. On average you get the exact same result as with 4. The difference is that it is only required to perform the action - not to actually be successful at it. Weapons have an XP modifier. A weapon with a higher modifier "generates" more XP per damage done. With a sniper rifle you are going to cause damage directly. Modifier = 1. With a machine gun you are more likely to lay down suppressive fire, hitting less often. Modifier = 2 If a lucky 21% hit from a MG eats up 42% of the alien's XP pool, the sniper can only "gain" XP equivalent to the remaining 58% XP, even if the alien has 79% of it's hit points left. This models the fact that a 100% suppressed alien is not very dangerous. Your sniper has an easy and safe job - more like on the firing range. This (5.) is just an option. It could be dropped completely if suppression/stun damage also count as XP-worthy events. [*] What kind of stats are being trained depends on the weapon used. Some examples... Grenade XP Modifier = 1 (but can hurt multiple targets...) 35% Strength 20% hidden stat for extra throwing range / accuracy 20% HP 25% AP [*] Sniper Rifle XP Modifier = 1 50% Accuracy 20% Reflexes 30% AP [*] Shotgun XP Modifier = 1.5 30% AP 25% Reflexes 25% Accuracy 20% HP [*] Machine Gun XP Modifier = 1.8 40% Strength 20% Accuracy 20% AP 20% Reflexes Every weapon would train all stats to differing degrees. I only listed some key points to illustrate the concept. Stat training is job specific and scales with how much a soldier contributes. Getting shot in the head does not make you tougher! One spin-off of this would be to assign a different training distribution to different fire modes of a weapon. An assault rifle using aimed shots would shift the points a bit from strength towards accuracy. [*] New recruits. The FNG could not contribute a lot - especially in an advanced game with much more dangerous aliens. Since he can't hurt them a lot, he would not gain a lot of XP. Ranks would have XP modifiers. A recruit gains a "training effect bonus" after the XP has been deducted from the alien's XP pool. In the early game this is balanced by "easy aliens" having a small XP pool. Progression is normal. In the later game, a recruit doing some damage to a high-XP target will get a disproportionally large training effect and so be able to somewhat catch up to the rest of the team. [*] Calculation of post-mission stat increases. Every soldier has now received 6 (more in case of hidden stats?) different kinds of "training points", relating to the different character stats. For each stat there are two successive random rolls against this stat's training points to determine how many actual stat points you get out of this. After the first roll, 100 are deducted from this stat's training points. A weapon's "minor stats" have basically no chance to gain 2 points - no matter how much you reload. You can still weigh these rolls with the stat number if you want. That's just math. The rank-based XP bonus / reduction (7.) would already take care of most of that. [*] Promotions Promotions are based entirely on the total stat points of a soldier. Stat increases are contribution-based so promotions are in turn contribution-based. The distribution of initial stat points is random. If you can hire "experienced" recruits later in the game, these will have the rank that corresponds to their stat point total. (basically like it works now) Promotions have a negative effect on "skill training" (no bonus, see 7.)... but a positive effect on morale. The aliens will make sure you're going to fight more dangerous aliens so the malus to skill training will be taken care of. You want promotions for the morale increase. [*] The actual calculations are all simple and occur at exactly one point in the code - when damage of any kind is done. Well, and obviously with the mission debriefing.
  4. Training is about to be/has been removed from the game. Having outlined some possible squad roles, I was thinking about the training that could be put into place to support them. Training seems to have come up a lot a while ago, particularly here and on the old forums, but there have been issues. From the forums, the following points seem to have a consensus:- - Skills should be advanced in the Battlescape as much as possible. As many skills listed below are gained incrementally directly from battlescape encounters. - Micromanagement of training should be minimised. There are no training tiers. Soldiers either gain directly from combat or are deselected during training. So, either automatic or one nand done. - Skills are not perks. There should be no unrealistic special powers given to soldiers. No unrealistic superpower type abilities in the list. - Skills should be available to all soldiers. The use of roles below is purely suggestive and would not limit any soldier gaining any skill. - Soldiers should not be locked into a single, specific role. As no skills are locked in, it increases the scope to have a unique squad with every game. - Skills should reflect actual conditions/ functions within the game, to keep some realism. There is an emphasis on combat oriented skills, to keep things as close to the battlescape as possible The mount of adding content to the game to add new training regimes would be too much. training courses below are kept to the same approach as Basic training where possible. - Soldiers approaching the final mission should not be cookie cutter troops with similar stats/skills/equipment. With any number of skill combinations, there is little danger of generic final mission soldiers. - Skill bonuses should be increased gradually and are not the result of a single action. Each skill gained on the battlescape should be gained in a series of smaller steps, until the full bonus is received. - Skill increases are more difficult, the higher the skill level they are at. A step further would be to increase the length of time it takes to received a full bonus, with each progressive step further away form the last. - Soldiers may only train in a set number of skills at a time, when not in combat. Considering the training allocation, it is likely that a soldier will have to train in one skill at a time. A cap on the total number of non-battlescape skills is open for discussion. So bearing these points in mind, and with the allowance of having a bit of freedom since this isn’t likely to be seen in game, here are some suggestions. From the previous Roles thread, I’ve listed primary and secondary roles suggested within the game, with associated skills. This is followed by generic skills. After this, there is more freedom with ideas that are very unlikely to ever be seen in the vanilla game, but that are either interesting to consider or have been useful in previous X-Com games. This post started off form ideas around avoiding cookie cutter soldiers, after all. The final post, is a breakdown of the skills with brief introductions of the game play mechanisms.
  5. As I play through, I'm finding that the skill gap between new and old soldiers is far too great. Losing a couple of my elite troops is DEVASTATING. I've managed to recover, but I am admittedly using various exploits and doing my best to powertrain my lower-level troops to mitigate this. (Seriously. While my elites do the actual clearing of a UFO, I'll just have everyone else run calisthenics. It's really boring.) In addition, the later dropships have much larger troop complements, and adding new troops to your combat roster means you will be have some rookies. (Also it dilutes accuracy and reflex skill points.) Now then, in fear of Chris deciding to make troops indestructible, I decided to start coming up with some ideas to help mitigate this gap WITHOUT putting in any crutches. If you guys have ideas also, feel free to suggest them. Here's what I've got: 1.) Increase soldiers' starting stats while reducing the rate at which they gain stats. The most obvious way to reduce the skill gap is to literally reduce the skill gap. Go figure This would also add to the idea that our soldiers are the best in the world when they join us, not random village folk. 2.) Some form of skill and progress-based ways of increasing odds of survival. XCOM2012 had the bleeding out/stabilize mechanic, which is a reasonable way of approaching this. (Although they did make the stupid decision to have it come with a permanent hit to an important attribute, but that's beside the point.) Some other ways to go about it is to have researches and base buildings that increase the chances of a soldier's survival. In the buildings.xml file, I noticed a "Biosurgical Center," and I wonder if this was something that is/was intended to do just that. 3.) A "mentor bonus," where if a soldier is on a mission with / working closely with a better soldier, the rookie will gain stats at an increased rate. So it wouldn't help you get good soldiers at the beginning, but training replacements is more possible. 4.) Off-duty management, where you order the soldiers to actually DO something in between missions, rather than just chilling in the barracks. Things like "Obstacle course" to increase TUs and bravery, "Firing range" to increase accuracy and reflexes. "Weight training" to increase strength and resilience. It's more realistic than gaining skill ups in missions, because spending two days lifting weights does a lot more in the long run than five minutes schlepping gear about a battlefield. Of course, this option doesn't allow for battlefield experience, which is why I'd also recommend giving a flat +2 bonus to all skills per rank up. (Many of the things listed here would require a rebalance of how skills and promotions are gained.) 5.) A ticker- or research-based increase over time to rookie starting stats. Similar to 1.) but with this the starting troops would still have 50-60 in each stat but by lategame rookies would have perhaps 70-80 in each stat. Not enough to overcome the benefits of keeping troops alive, but allowing for easier replacement of elites by lategame.
  6. With Xenonaut roles within the game, I was thinking about what the soldiers were essentially used for. I’m keen to see the final part of the game still contain a number of viable roles for the soldiers. An issue with similar games is that there is an optimal set of equipment. Fortunately this is something the devs said that they are keen to avoid too. Of course, soldiers may move between roles as the game/ squad requirements progress. Here’s a breakdown of what I came up with. Primary Roles [TABLE=class: grid, width: 640, align: left] [TR] [td][/td] [TD]Assault/ Rifleman[/TD] [TD]All purpose role, providing mission flexibility. Interchanging between assault rifles and shotguns as required.[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [td][/td] [TD]Breach Specialist/ Shock Troop[/TD] [TD]Penetrating UFOs/buildings to establish bridgeheads. Breach shield and pistol standard.[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [td] [/td] [TD]LMG Support Gunner /Pigman[/TD] [TD]Increased, portable, firepower over short to medium range providing suppression/ cover fire.[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [td] [/td] [TD]Heavy Weapons/ Rocketeer/ Anti-Tank[/TD] [TD]Long range destructive/ anti armour capability.[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [td] [/td] [TD]Incendiary/ Flame Unit[/TD] [TD]Close to medium range controlled burning and incendiary penetration.[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [td] [/td] [TD]Recon/ Scout[/TD] [TD]Exploring ahead of main force, providing intel & targeting. Use of maximum APs through lighter equipment preferred.[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [td] [/td] [TD]Sniper/ Marksman[/TD] [TD]Long range precision shooting.[/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE]
  7. I have written up the entire concept once more... with a lot more structure and without all the half-baked ideas that lead to this version. All numbers were made up on the spot and only serve to demonstrate the intent. Too many unknowns to scale anything just yet. Of course others are invited to add summaries of their systems. (maybe use a different colour for the "headline"?) Please don't start a discussion about bits and pieces of either. I simplified several obscure mechanics from the discussion thread. More transparent and predictable now, which should make it easy for the player to balance his troopers' advancement vs the specialist abilities they acquire. Give everyone 10 special training courses and they will advance their stats more slowly - but have all the special perks. Yet, the player can build his army of universal soldiers if he so desires... Even training strategies become a possibility! "Hang on" with less educated grunts who increase their skills faster... or train them right away and get slower advancement long term. How cool is that? That is gameplay the players can and will argue about. Real choices! =) It makes replaying the game a real possibility because you could play with a different strategy. Recruiting soldiers and other personnel is in many ways related because it also takes a look at the starting stats of soldier and the potential change to the importance of training. The "Alternate Training Concept" is a far more "condensed" concept which is more suited to a strategic approach to training without micromanaging individual soldiers on a regular base.
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