ccrunner1756 Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Hi all, So first off I want to say Im relatively new to the game but I absolutely love it. I watched a streamer play through it on V19 stable and I have been playing through it on v20 stable. This post is about how smoke grenades work in V20 stable and my thoughts. I apologize if this is the wrong place for this. I think the way smoke currently works (100% miss all the time) is A. easy to abuse and too forgiving B. breaks the immersion in the game. A) Currently you can pop a smoke grenade and advance 1 or 2 troops into the smoke. From that position they cant be harmed (except by an alien grenade which I have not yet had happen when completely surrounded by smoke). These two troops can then unload your choice of frag, C4, stun, or what have you. This will take out the alien with 0 risk to your troops. This tactic is highly effective. I was able to complete 3 missions ( scout, corvette, and landing ship) without firing a shot and capturing every alien. If you have made a wrong decision you can pop a smoke and almost guarantee the exposed solider will survive. I actually find it harder to kill an alien than capture one. That should definitely not be the case. B) I have a hard time believing that a solider 4 tiles away from an alien with a single tile of smoke between the two cant land a single shot from a lmg. The animation even shows every shot landing. Could I hear some thoughts on why the change was made to the way smoke works from V19 to V20? I am really enjoying the game and think the developers have done an amazing job but I would really like to see smoke go back to the way it used to be. I think there should be an accuracy penalty when shooting through smoke but the idea of smoke being completely impenetrable is a poor choice in such a well thought out game. It is smoke after all. Not bullet proof armor. Thanks for reading. TL:DR Smoke is not armor and should go back to being an accuracy penalty similar to V19. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smoitessier Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Yeah I echo that, but forgot the reasoning behind it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KateMicucci Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Agreed. Smoke is pretty cheesy right now. It can be used as a "get out of death free" card or to charge with C4 at no risk as you described. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ventuswings Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 I have to agree at current inplementation there is little to no counter to smoke. It's not just AI problem, I myself would be able to do much less should alien start using smokes. There are recent discussion about other tactics, such as shields, being ineffective compared to smoke, and while some of these concerns are valid, smoking is just OP tactic with little risk high reward that is effective at all situations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ventuswings Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Also OP, you're probably thinking of pre-V19 smoke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrashMan Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 I've had aliens charge into smoke and killing my guys inside the smoke. It's only safe if the AI decides not to advance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llunak Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Well, it's apparently safe enough. Just watch some of the videos Ol'Stinky has put on YouTube - that's not fights, that's ridiculous parades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrashMan Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 The AI should occasionally try a blind shot into the smoke. But given how powerfull aliens are, I don't mind smoke - even moreso since MY exprience with it isn't so negative. Granted, after the aliens killed 2 of my guys in smoke I started relying less on it, but still. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llunak Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 If the aliens are way too powerful, the fix is not to make the smoke way too powerful as well, but to fix the real problem. How much fun is it to play a game that has a cheap get-out-of-the-jail card? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsisk Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 I've had more problems with smoke hindering my troops. I can understand it hindering my soldier's shots, but It won't let me blind fire past the danged smoke. I saw an alien there before the smoke went up...I think he's right...What? The reticle X of doom "DENIED!" ;( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dead Dread Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 just wait til you face Wraiths, they will teleport into the smoke right next to your guy and blast them or teleport straight through it, around it and have you completely flanked. But early on, yeah it can be exploited pretty easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 OK. We'll look into it. Previously the AI couldn't handle pre-V19 smoke at all but it's had some upgrades that should leave it better equipped to deal with it. Also the accuracy formula changes mean you can't do the "shoot the tile behind the target" exploit any more, which was the other major problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccrunner1756 Posted January 14, 2014 Author Share Posted January 14, 2014 Thanks all for reading and commenting. And thanks for taking another look Chris and team. I am loving the game and very excited for the final release! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiago_oldman Posted January 16, 2014 Share Posted January 16, 2014 Smoke usually is handled by aliens now. They simply cross it. But it is still strong enoguh to buy you 1 or 2 turns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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