Aaron Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 I posted up a new build over the weekend, but only got around to updating these posts now. Notable changes: - New maps for the Middle East tile set (these are different from the "Desert" tile set). These are essentially final, but they will probably need fixes/tweaks, so feedback would be much appreciated. - Morale system has been rebalanced, with the intention of reducing the instances where the whole team panics and increasing the instances where individuals do. We also fixed a major hidden bug that meant the morale system was basically going unused - so I'm really interested to hear general feedback on how you are finding morale in general now; right now I don't think the morale system plays a big enough part. - Some minor changes to the AI, but which hopefully have a fairly decent impact. They should fire more regularly now, and spend less time trying to hide from the player line of sight. We are getting more of the internal AI systems revealed in a configuration file soon, so we will have more flexibility to make changes in future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 I had two morale incidents in my 15-20 or so crash missions. Once was when I opened an ufo door and the aliens reacted. Lots of suppression and one guy hit. This made one of the rookies berserk for a round. Unpleasant but unfatal. Another time was when I lost 4 men on a night mission. One of my guys panicked for a round but that was it. If there is any "impact" of morale other than this, it is very subtle and I didn't notice it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dranak Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 I haven't seen any morale events yet, but the AI changes are noticeable. It makes for a much more playable experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foehammer343 Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 I didnt think of much at the time, but during a mission when my squad was ganging a Sebelian non-com one of his reaction fires, which didnt hit, caused a rookie to panic for a turn. The odd thing was no one had died yet and no one had taken any damage for several turns if at all. While your tweaking the morale system, if its not too much work, can you have message pop up whenever something actually reduces the troops morale? It doesnt have to say to who or by what amount, just that it happened and its cause. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StellarRat Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 I posted up a new build over the weekend, but only got around to updating these posts now.- Morale system has been rebalanced, with the intention of reducing the instances where the whole team panics and increasing the instances where individuals do. We also fixed a major hidden bug that meant the morale system was basically going unused - so I'm really interested to hear general feedback on how you are finding morale in general now; right now I don't think the morale system plays a big enough part. Do the non-mechanical aliens have morale? They did in the OG. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oronoc Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Really not a fan of the accuracy against crouched targets, sniper going from mid 80% chance to hit to 50% because the alien got suppressed and crouched standing in the open, every battle gets so drawn out and boring as you watch everyone miss one another because we're all crouched. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted November 5, 2013 Author Share Posted November 5, 2013 I am probably going to decrease the bonus you get from crouching a bit. There's also a bug with it right now where crouching is far too effective at close range, which will be fixed too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 As for GC; not sure if this is part of it or not, but default hand grenades and thrown items are generally feeling underwhelming. I haven't seen any aliens throw nades yet - I might be in for a surprise tho As human I feel that explosive grenades cant be thrown very far at all. They do not punch the enemies hard at all either. I stopped bringing them, and instead of copious amounts of smoke grenades to cover my advance in open terrain. Aliens seem to attack me from inside their spaceships even with the door closed, shooting plasma bolts at the door and actually I see some fly through even if the door is closed still. This is an experience from Light Scouts and Scouts. As if they can spot me through the walls. Do they have windows or "portholes" or is it a bug? [Confirmed a bug in other thread] Only snipers and machine guns seem to do any kind of suppression now. IS it intentional? I do find it worrisome that my up-and-close assault trooper with a shotgun is unable to at least suppress a foe after having blasted two cartridges in the face at close range. It makes me want to mix my squads with more heavy troopers and riflemen now, and less assaults as soon as I get Jackal armor and riot shields. [Confirmed in other thread that Shotties will get suppression bonus] Suppression can be a cheesy tactic, but its a vital element in my tactics. Pin enemy, flank and annihilate. Assaulties in pairs should be excellent for that, one pins the other kills. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted November 5, 2013 Author Share Posted November 5, 2013 Shotties will get a suppression bonus, but the answer to some weapons being worse at suppression than others is kind of the point - the weapons are not all equal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 @Aaron but of course. I bring HMGs for that particular thing: High suppression score. If my M16 did the same just as good, why even bring the HMG? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StellarRat Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 LMG is a much deadlier weapon even without the suppression factor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 6, 2013 Share Posted November 6, 2013 LMG is a much deadlier weapon even without the suppression factor. Sorry. LMG. Not HMG And yes, I have realised this my self too. LMGs pack quite a punch, but are inaccurate. Their excellent suppression at long range mitigates that. Problem is that M16 is sort of a naff weapon since partial damaged aliens function just as well as a completely healed alien. Shotty and LMG has a high chance to eliminate enemy, where as M16 needs to be 2 squares away and on full auto to really matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemm Posted November 6, 2013 Share Posted November 6, 2013 Is it no longer possible to throw smoke into a UFO and spray machine gun fire inside now that 0% shots NEVER hit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted November 7, 2013 Author Share Posted November 7, 2013 I haven't tried that specifically, but 0% shots simply never hit their intended target - I think they would still have a chance to hit aliens "by accident". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 I haven't tried that specifically, but 0% shots simply never hit their intended target - I think they would still have a chance to hit aliens "by accident". Aaron, note that when you toss smoke inside an ufo, and if you close the door, in the next turn the roof of the ufo does not remove itself, making it impossible for you to shoot inside the ufo at a "blind spot". You have to enter the ufo before you can get the roof to go away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted November 7, 2013 Author Share Posted November 7, 2013 Is that really a bug? The UFO hull is hidden when you have LOS inside the UFO. IF you throw smoke in there and block your LOS, why would you still expect it to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max_Caine Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Supression, if I'm any judge. EDIT: And grenades don't need to be too accurate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vaultdweller Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Is that really a bug? The UFO hull is hidden when you have LOS inside the UFO. IF you throw smoke in there and block your LOS, why would you still expect it to? If you have line-of-fire but not line-of-sight, you ought to still be able to take blind shots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StellarRat Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 If you have line-of-fire but not line-of-sight, you ought to still be able to take blind shots.Yeah, probably should be able to hose down an area even if you can't see anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemm Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 1. Did the sniper weapons get nerfed? It seems like the main battle rifle is more accurate than the sniper rifle unless the target is completely unobstructed. If it's going to be this way, then I think that the sniper rifle should not have such a high TU cost, since it has a smaller ammo capacity. 2. This has probably been asked before, but would it be possible to make the carbines usable with the assault shield, albeit with a drastically reduced effective range? 3. Would it be possible to give soldiers a second visual range, slightly longer than the existing one, that allows them to see "dimmed" tiles before they get full vision of a tile? This is mostly to make the game look better, because I think the transition from complete vision to complete darkness is a bit abrupt. In might also make the game look a bit more realistic without breaking the existing LOS balance, because it would allow the soldiers to reveal the terrain in front of them at greater-than-myopic distances like they do now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted November 8, 2013 Author Share Posted November 8, 2013 FYI guys build 3 is out - not enough changes to warrant a new thread, so I'll just update the title. The main gameplay affecting change is that soldiers now take a morale penalty for being injured and taking suppression "damage" - this should make individual units panic much more frequently; other morale values have been tuned to take this into account. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 8, 2013 Share Posted November 8, 2013 A note on smoke grenades: I use them a lot to cover my advance and I do find that aliens shoot into them if I am spotted in the same turn and then hide. The same mechanic is valid for me as a player. I can shoot Orange aliens even though there is a lack of sight. So in general it works fair. Do aliens shoot into smoke clouds "blindly" if they have spotted a player the turn before? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max_Caine Posted November 8, 2013 Share Posted November 8, 2013 Feedback on the new maps They don't suck. Okay, now the long version. Most of the maps I've played on are desert-ish levels. I like the thickets of trees, and the way they connect together. In fact, all the maps I've played do seem to be interconnected to a greater degree. So yeah, they don't suck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legit1337 Posted November 8, 2013 Share Posted November 8, 2013 (edited) @aaron I'm loving whatever you did to accuracy in the new experimental version. I'm not sure if anyone has said this already, but close range combat still seems a bit wonky, even with the new accuracy tweaks. Specifically, tactics for room clearing. Stacking on the door seems to be a bad idea due to current mechanics... Isn't this wrong though? Almost all modern military/police tactics for room clearing involve stacking on doors prior to a breach. Shouldn't we be finding ways to make the game "authentic" (not using the word "realistic" here). Also, grenades still suck, had another incident where 3 direct hits couldn't kill a caesean non-com (also current version, difficulty:hard). Edited November 8, 2013 by legit1337 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 8, 2013 Share Posted November 8, 2013 Im with Legit: Grenades are bad. I'd trade their pinpoint laser accuracy for some more damage, at least temporarily to see how they are doing and how higher damage impacts them. "Cost" should be a little more spread in where they land. Also room clearing: My tactic would be to open door and toss flashbangs to suppress aliens. It seems to land me with 1-2 dead soliders every time due to reaction fire even if my flash bang connects. The new "gamey" tactic is to open door and keep everybody out of sight, then throw a smoke grenade at an angle so the aliens cant see me. End turn, then move into the smoke and take them out close range. It works, but it feels that Im gaming the mechanics of the game here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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