5.22+ Ground Combat] Grenade Luncher is a random weapon, designed to be used only in save scum play-style

[gG-Unknown]

I have noticed the  wierd  misfire again. Check the vid.

 

Edited January 19 by gG-Unknown

[Kouki]

3 hours ago, gG-Unknown said:

I have noticed the  wierd  misfire again. Check the vid.

 

Thanks, we'll give it a look

[gG-Unknown]

Another case. If I understand correctly the current mechanic, (feel free to correct me). 

1. Character roll %,

2. if % is under the  hit chance then he hit the central tile Sucess

3. if the roll is higher. then another two random rolls are made a] for angle, in range +/- 10 degree b] for deviation

4. grenade calculates new ballistic curve for the new target

5. hit the new target

What we see here is a miss chance which has about 45degree change  and some massive deviation too. It looks to me like the old code somewhat sneak in again.

 

[Chris]

On 4/9/2025 at 12:56 AM, gG-Unknown said:

I have noticed the  wierd  misfire again. Check the vid.

 

The scatter on the grenade launcher is a bit wild here - it looks like it's shooting about 45 degrees to the right, which is too much.

The problem looks much worse because the game traces the path to see what intervening object will be hit, but then it fires the grenade at the tile in front of the intervening object. So instead of looking like the grenade smacks into the wall of a building (hitting it mid-way through the arc), it instead calculates a whole new full arc that ends just in front of the object and never actually hits the intervening object.

Fixing that will make a lot of these issues go away, because it'll be obvious what's actually happening. It's just a complicated fix and we haven't had time to do it yet.

[gG-Unknown]

32 minutes ago, Chris said:

 the game traces the path to see what intervening object will be hit, but then it fires the grenade at the tile in front of the intervening object. So instead of looking like the grenade smacks into the wall of a building (hitting it mid-way through the arc), it instead calculates a whole new full arc that ends just in front of the object and never actually hits the intervening object.

I see. So grenade made a miss % roll. It Should hit just a corner of the intervening building, but calculating algorithm used the whole object (e.i. centre of the building) as a new target. It sounds overcomplicated indeed. I am not a mathematician wizard, but something reliable have to exist, all those CounterSttrikes/Fortinight shooters have to use a ballistic maths in 3d which goes fast and precise.

Also one note, when you reserve time for  a grenade day improvement, make ballistic curve flexible. Hand grenade should moderate lenght (range) by initial velocity, but grenade luncher not. Grenade Luncher projectile initial velocity must be the same, all the time, range regardless. Ballistic curve for grenade  luncher shooting at 3 tile  distance should be almost straight. Current curve is nonsense :-] When you get to this point, set ballistic curve also for rockets on MARS. Set them very flat ballistic curve ( faster initial velocity than R.Luncher). This will look great.

Edited April 11, 2025 by gG-Unknown

[gG-Unknown]

Another case. Thing is getting even wilder. It do not fallow you previous explanation of alghoritm using a wrong part of a large object as new miss-target.

he is on 5.23 e.i. the day-night bug is still active.

 

[gG-Unknown]

Another case. This one looks almost good, almost.  Misfire angle is ok, but misfire range deviation is way off. About half of intended range. I think that  misfire deviation (the range from intended target) should be computed. Based on  range.The formula goes simple like this : triangle which spans between soldier ( standing on vertex with internal max angle 20 degree ) then intended target is in the middle of hypotenuse. Max range  of misfire is half length of Hypotenuse. So basically, misfire possible targets are located in a circle around the intended target. Size of the circle  is set by range. It meeans, closer you aim, shorter misfire deviation you get.

 

[gG-Unknown]

I have found a triangle calculator for you.

It is a soldier standing on C shooting at range 15 tiles, max miss angle is +/- 10 degree then misfire deviation is based on Side c = 5,209 tiles.

Side c is  a width of circle, so the misfire range we looking for is half >>> rounded up >>> 3 tiles. It is wise to exclude the intended target from possible missfire targets, this way we prevent a paradox that miss could change into hit. So  we simply run a random function from 2 up to 3.

Well we see that when target is in the range of 15 misfire is either 2 OR 3 tiles. Current results are wildly broken.  

https://www.calculator.net/triangle-calculator.html?vc=20&vx=15&vy=15&va=&vz=&vb=&angleunits=d&x=Calculate

[Zwane]

omg its GGbeyond himself who speak ? i love your lets play

 

[gG-Unknown]

Misfire Grenade on your own toe and hit two team mates too.

Eyeballing gas grenade effect vid is recorded on 5.25.0 most probably

 

Edited April 25, 2025 by gG-Unknown

[gG-Unknown]

I dont know if you ninja patched the grenade luncher, but I have spotted the most ridiculous misfire ever.

It miss so much that it shoot backwards, to hit  4 tiles behind his back. He plays the latest version, about 5.30 +

 

Edited May 22, 2025 by gG-Unknown

[gG-Unknown]

I dont use MARS personally (too expensive and no xp gain), also youtubers I fallow usually dont use MARS, but someone tried.

Pay attention to the face cam === >  Highly valuable feedback for you developers !

It looks that MARS received similar weird miss mechanic as  Grenade luncher. Therfore I am going to add MARS rocket  weirdness to the same collection.

I think it is the same root-cause.

I hope you can  fix MARS AND Gr. luncher for Milestone 6.

 

Edited May 31, 2025 by gG-Unknown

[gG-Unknown]

It has been 9 months since I started this topic, yet, still the same.

Grenade  luncher hit chance 90%,  but result miss is more than half of the intended range.

On top, dmg is inferior due to dmg  fall of improvement, and blast range is same as  grenade.  Potentially, Fun weapon but turned into  crap.

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2635944552?t=02h07m58s

 

and another one from same stream, range about 12 miss drop at own feet, hit herself and 2 team mates. Terrible system of miss targets

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2635944552?t=02h07m58s

I  think blast range should be  bigger than hand grenade. plus 0,5

Reload should be one by one, in FIFO style, so it is possible to  hold different grenades inside the weapon.

I think the triangle calculator should be used, see few posts above

Edited December 7, 2025 by gG-Unknown

[gG-Unknown]

Almost a year since I started this topic.

STILL NO CHANGE

Grenade Luncher is a random weapon, designed to be used only in save scum play-style.

 

Edited January 19 by gG-Unknown

[Chris]

On 1/19/2026 at 3:50 PM, gG-Unknown said:

Almost a year since I started this topic.

STILL NO CHANGE

Grenade Luncher is a random weapon, designed to be used only in save scum play-style.

 

Ugh. Thanks, we'll take a look.

[Chris]

On 1/19/2026 at 3:50 PM, gG-Unknown said:

Almost a year since I started this topic.

STILL NO CHANGE

Grenade Luncher is a random weapon, designed to be used only in save scum play-style.

 

Koki has been trying to reproduce this for a while now and we can't do it at all. If you encounter issues like this again then please provide saves, because videos aren't that helpful when it comes to fixing them.

[gG-Unknown]

14 hours ago, Chris said:

Koki has been trying to reproduce this for a while now and we can't do it at all. If you encounter issues like this again then please provide saves, because videos aren't that helpful when it comes to fixing them.

it is random. I guess that  standard shot has a chance to fly anywhere.  Probably, Ctrl-key variant of aim do not have the issue. At least, I didnt see any case in M5 (I used gr. louncher in m5, but  dont use it in m6 because of issues)

Anyway, as I said, grenade louncher is broken and save scum is not my style, therefore I can not provide you any save from M6.

Perhaps use an automatic testing script instead of Kouki :=)

Edited January 29 by gG-Unknown