Bobit Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 There are three ways that OpenX and Xenonauts 1 allow the AI to not be picked off one by one 1) Vision through walls - psi / scent 2) More vision than humans 3) Firing on things not in their LoS Which of these do you think are currently implemented? I think none. Which do you think ought to be implemented? I think all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charon Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 (1) In X1 aliens cant see through walls. They can however "hear" you, up to 8 to 10 tiles. I think this function was too strong in X1, and should be reduced in its effects as well as "walls" dampening the range of it. If you want to put the human on equal footing maybe implement sound based on distance and action type ( similiar to the aliens ). (3) In X1 aliens cant fire at what they cant see. Remember they have squad sight though, just like you. One of the side effects of the more stronger coding in X1 let aliens throw grenades on bunched up soldiers - whether they had vision or not. This could be addressed so that that function needs the visual component first, in order to prevent "blind grenades". (2) All main races had equal sight range in the vanilla game, harridans and wraiths had one more, and reapers had two more tiles of sight range. Not really "the world". 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffee Potato Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 On 6/28/2019 at 11:41 AM, Charon said: (1) In X1 aliens cant see through walls. They can however "hear" you, up to 8 to 10 tiles. I think this function was too strong in X1, and should be reduced in its effects as well as "walls" dampening the range of it. If you want to put the human on equal footing maybe implement sound based on distance and action type ( similiar to the aliens ). (3) In X1 aliens cant fire at what they cant see. Remember they have squad sight though, just like you. One of the side effects of the more stronger coding in X1 let aliens throw grenades on bunched up soldiers - whether they had vision or not. This could be addressed so that that function needs the visual component first, in order to prevent "blind grenades". (2) All main races had equal sight range in the vanilla game, harridans and wraiths had one more, and reapers had two more tiles of sight range. Not really "the world". Great to get confirmation on this. Those Cesean swat raids ended so many vanilla runs for me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrR0ket01 Posted July 4, 2019 Share Posted July 4, 2019 On 6/28/2019 at 4:30 PM, Bobit said: There are three ways that OpenX and Xenonauts 1 allow the AI to not be picked off one by one 1) Vision through walls - psi / scent 2) More vision than humans 3) Firing on things not in their LoS Which of these do you think are currently implemented? I think none. Which do you think ought to be implemented? I think all. Sadly i have to confirm Number 3. I bought yesterday X2 and checked out what the progress was only to find out 2 of my guys got shot through a wooden cabin with no direct LOS or window only to be killed instantly. Lucky me i had some previous saves to revert some moves. I thought about posting it here but since i saw your post theres no need anymore ill. I can if demanded record this cause thats justa huge gamebreaker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 23 hours ago, MrR0ket01 said: Sadly i have to confirm Number 3. I bought yesterday X2 and checked out what the progress was only to find out 2 of my guys got shot through a wooden cabin with no direct LOS or window only to be killed instantly. Lucky me i had some previous saves to revert some moves. I thought about posting it here but since i saw your post theres no need anymore ill. I can if demanded record this cause thats justa huge gamebreaker. If this happens to you, a save game or video or anything that lets us see where the shots came from would be helpful. Aliens shouldn't be able to be shoot through solid objects, so possibly some objects haven't been set up correctly if so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 On 6/28/2019 at 3:30 PM, Bobit said: There are three ways that OpenX and Xenonauts 1 allow the AI to not be picked off one by one 1) Vision through walls - psi / scent 2) More vision than humans 3) Firing on things not in their LoS Which of these do you think are currently implemented? I think none. Which do you think ought to be implemented? I think all. None of this is implemented but there's basically no AI yet so I wouldn't worry too much about it. Once we've implemented the first major AI upgrade we'll start to take additional action if the AI is still dumb and easily picked off. I'd rather it didn't cheat in most instances though! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffee Potato Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 I haven't seen 3 yet personally, and I'm glad to say I haven't yet randomly died to an invisible shot from a corner I had someone watching. I guess glasses tech improved by 2018. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobit Posted July 6, 2019 Author Share Posted July 6, 2019 (edited) @Chris Keep in mind the player cheats too! The respective equivalents are: 1) Once players spot an enemy, they will send their 100% TUs allies to attack them, making for a much more rapid response. They are also capable of guessing where the enemy is. 2) Players fight 8v4 due to shared vision (they can pick off enemies) 3) Players can (in most games) fire from squadsight, and in all games share vision @Coffee Potato This is a very popular feature in OpenXCOM. Essentially a soldier can either be seen by the enemy or cannot. However all units do get halved accuracy when firing past LoS. Hit and run can be done but you have to hide all of your units. Edited July 6, 2019 by Bobit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffee Potato Posted July 6, 2019 Share Posted July 6, 2019 Halved accuracy past LoS sounds perfect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decius Posted July 7, 2019 Share Posted July 7, 2019 If you're going to apply penalties for firing at something in squadsight, be sure to provide feedback regarding what the soldier can see, and information about where they would be able to see a target, as well as what they would be able to see from other locations. That's a chunk of UI design, right there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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