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Xenonauts-2 Base System Discussion Thread

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3 hours ago, Rodmar18 said:

We could have the best of two systems.

Yeah it could be.. but there is two details here..

1. Having 2 views of base to build something would be very tiresome for players.. it's like playing tetris at a 3D space. It looks cool but after a short time, you will see that it's very difficult to plan and execute.. 

2. You don't need so many buildings to need a huge 3D base.. imagine an xenonauts 1 or xcom base with 3 floor.. so basicly 3x bigger.. even 1 base mostly enough to have all your workshop, scientists, soldiers, stores and some hangars in it.. so a 3x base would be overkill..

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On 8/14/2018 at 4:11 PM, drages said:

Yeah it could be.. but there is two details here..

1. Having 2 views of base to build something would be very tiresome for players.. it's like playing tetris at a 3D space. It looks cool but after a short time, you will see that it's very difficult to plan and execute.. 

2. You don't need so many buildings to need a huge 3D base.. imagine an xenonauts 1 or xcom base with 3 floor.. so basicly 3x bigger.. even 1 base mostly enough to have all your workshop, scientists, soldiers, stores and some hangars in it.. so a 3x base would be overkill..

I always build 2 additional bases close to the main one for research. My 200+ scientists need laboratories and sleeping spots.

Engineering was done in main base due to the storage system.

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Whether you use the top down view, or side on, only matters, in how it can be simulated, on the screen, when it comes to displaying it when the base is being attached?

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We already know that ground combat should occur on a 2D-grid, generic map built around a command center, whatever the real layout is. The later discussion here is only about base management, i.e. space management, related building order, and management gameplay (and eye-candy).

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I hope the topic is still open :D

In regards of top down versus side view - it doesn't matter that much to me as long as it feels meaningful, purposeful etc? Like adding some room types only to make "a lot's of different rooms that player has to put in the base" versus "having meaningful constructions". That being said - having too much "junk" and "stuff" to clean and watch over to make the base operational feels a little tedious. Same thing like in Xcom2 with flying around to collect supplies... ugh.

On the other hand - if the general concept is interesting and dosn't work in isolation it starts to feel nice. For example I saw here a mention of a mission where you need to get reactor core in order to install it in your base. That's what would make it actually interesting.

Some random ideas and thoughts I get:

  • Having one main base but many secondary dedicated locations - meaning not all other locations have full base view, it's like the aircraft base idea, just put it somewhere and have two buttons to upgrade hangar slots and radar coverage, no layout required for me. Additionally why keep all the stuff in Atlas? I mean it has restricted space etc. and it if you make aircraft bases around the globe it doesn't make logical sense for me that you can't have other dedicated sties also - like having factory to build aircrafts for example. Or having a research center because there are those few research programs that are dangerous and have to be made in some isolated space etc. - yes, defense of those bases would be hard, making them concealed also. Maybe have some finite list of shelter bases - and you re-purpose them for one specific task. This bunker will be my new research facility, this one is a warehouse etc. it does make it feel more "global". Keeping them from being assaulted and bombarded would require having interceptor coverage (airbases), paying for some defenses (not necessarily laying them out) and send your team when you know a certain site will be attacked - so they arrive in few variants - a minute before the attack, during the first phase of the attack, or after the aliens actually breached the first defenses, and the worst scenario when they actually have infiltrated the base. And you have to either protect the base, or get some important stuff out of it - be that an engineer, scientist, a weapon prototype etc. depending on the stage of alien assault of course
    • TLDR: placing more than only air base in geoscape, having research bases, workshops etc. making them a strategic targets but not need to have full layout and building them and managing
  • In connection the the above - don't try to push all stuff into the Atlas base - make hangars a part of external on the surface things - maybe have the option of hidden air bases later? If something doesn't make sense in the Atlas - place it outside. Either by "surface" base layout (actually it might be a decision in game "ok we are expanding Atlas on the surface now!" so it changes into one big target for aliens) or by remote bases

Also it depends on what sort of a feeling one wants to achieve. Let's take fireaxis x-com 2 - they wanted resistance and guerilla feeling. There is not interceptors and hangars and fighters because the resistance doesn't have those. On the other hand you need to grab supplies, avoid patrols etc. this enforces certain feeling in the game. What sort of a feeling Xe2 wants to have?

Global defense - multiple bases sound more realistic and enforce the feeling of actually defending the planet. Xe1 has this feeling even with showing a lot of events that occur outside the radar coverage you feel you need to expand.

We lose the first strike - single base, but then interceptors and fighters shouldn't be something that is available from the start, aliens have the upper hand so if they nuked first xenonauts base I expect they bombed also other air bases around the world. Getting a single air base should feel like an achievement! Not to say keeping it from being destroyed. So setting up an air base and getting some fighters should feel like it takes some time and it's an accomplishment. Putting next bases might be easier but "pushing back" feeling should be enforced - like you can't simply get a new base in the other side of the world just like that. You have your starting region and you expanding from it bit by bit reclaiming. This is actually a little how Xcom2 feels. It just logical - if we lost the first strike there must be consequences and you can't just make Atlas base and now I can build air bases with condors around the globe where I want, I lost, I'm one step behind, putting an air base shouldn't be as easy like "ok, we relocate to Atlas, in the meantime please set up two air bases one in north america and one in china".

There must be gameplay consequences that tie into the narrative I guess. Same with reclaiming the reactor mission - reclaiming air initiative could (and maybe should) be also tied into a mission or series of first missions. I think that would be interesting.

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On 7/2/2018 at 8:33 AM, Chris said:

Ah yes, your post reminds me of something I meant to mention in the original post - one of the big problems with having pre-existing base locations on the map (i.e. stuff you can "liberate" from the locals and re-purpose) is that the player then loses the fine control over where there bases are placed. This actually kinda matters when you're using the realtime Geoscape because planes have to fly towards their targets and having a base in a bad position just because the game wouldn't let you choose where to place it is likely to be frustrating.

You partially can get around this by offering more possible locations for bases - but then you've got a lot of useless stuff cluttering up the Geoscape. Even having 8 base locations on the map (which in reality is far less than you would need) adds a huge amount of extra clutter to the map. 

We did experiment with pre-existing bases for a bit and they ended up being kinda awkward for those reasons.

The Easiest way to deal with the preposition base issue is to make the mission be "to a secret base location within  (Fill in the region)". After the mission you get to place the base within that region. You make the first day of the game be one of these missions to get your first base placed. You only get one "mission" for a free base in a region per game, timing on when could be based on relations and how well you are doing etc. Otherwise to place a base in aregion you need some sort of "good" relations withthem so they will "seel/lease" a base to you.

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