Gauddlike Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 I think for a physical copy a dvd case with the professionally disk in it, a thin manual, and a properly printed cover sleeve is more likely. Those old fashioned boxes are pointless and usually end up in the bin or stuck in a box in the loft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lodium Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 (edited) I'ev had that before when I've ordered a CD copy from an Indie dev. It's just not the same. Maybe if you had a REALLY good printer but otherwise it'll end up looking like a pirate copy you bought off ebay I was looking for a point to argument this. I have seen that debate before where they had pictures of Factory produced CD and a Home produced CD with Arts and inlays, you almost coudnt tell the diffrance hadnt it been for barcode wich wasnt present on the fake. I didnt find that debate but i found something else that migth be usefull. http://www.pure-music.co.uk/ This company Press and prints DVD,s and Cd,s Its UK based in Manchester Il quote this from one of the pages on their website : But lets not forget, no matter which method of CD printing you choose, you will not be able to make a bad design look good, but you can make a good design look great….. Edited May 13, 2012 by Lodium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
targetbsp Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 It's that 'almost' though. Looks fine from a distance but up close it's just ever so slightly lacking in definition. However good home and office printers have got - they aren't as what people whose business it is to print things have. And whilst offering such an item is fine for those that want a physical backup or to save download bandwidth I don't think it's suitable for a scenario like this where you are basically offering it as a collectible incentive for people to spend more money is it? Let me put it this way. I would pay a premium for a professionally printed box but I wouldn't for something I could download and print myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lodium Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 So youre saying if a indie musician press and prints his own CD,s to save money beacause its cheapen than to outsource it, you will pirate his album? Also : According to the dictionary, 'indie' is an informal version of the word independent. Although this definition is accurate, the word has come to mean more. For many, it has come to symbolize originality and forward-thinking, especially in music and design. By this definition, indie is any business or designer that is not associated with a large company. Indie can also define the consumer who chooses to support small business, independent record labels and handmade items rather than shopping at big-box stores. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gauddlike Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 So youre saying if a indie musician press and prints his own CD,s to save money beacause its cheapen than to outsource it, you will pirate his album? I am not quite sure where you got that from but I don't think that is what anyone said. What I read is that if you are paying for what you believe to be a high quality collectors edition and you receive an OK quality home made one they would feel a little cheated. If they know in advance that it won't be top quality then it isn't an issue for most people. If I bought a game from a shop and it looked like the dvd was home printed I would be concerned. If it had a huge sticker on it that said "home pressed so all your money goes to the developer" then I would be able to make the choice before purchasing. If you make clear before hand that what they will get will be something Chris has made at home, with his own handwriting on it in CD marker pen (and hopefully spelt right), then that would be what they were expecting and therefore fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorlom Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 So youre saying if a indie musician press and prints his own CD,s to save money beacause its cheapen than to outsource it, you will pirate his album? No, I' probably just not buy it or download it or listen to it at all. Why is the only options buying something homepressed (that you seem to be implying is to be marketed as a professionally made product) or stealing it? Why isn't this hypothetical artist looking into digital distribution? Edit: I agree with what Gauddlike said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haba Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 I think for a physical copy a dvd case with the professionally disk in it, a thin manual, and a properly printed cover sleeve is more likely.Those old fashioned boxes are pointless and usually end up in the bin or stuck in a box in the loft. I wouldn't (and will not) buy a physical copy if it only comes in standard dvd case. Physical copies for me are premium goods - and thus the box needs to be premium quality as well. You know, something that I can proudly put on display next to other classics. Cheap piece of plastic has no value in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gauddlike Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 (edited) Well on the occasions that I go to gigs at local pubs I have no objection to picking up a cd if they were any good. I expect them to be home made as most of those groups are not making any real money out of it. It is a completely different situation really as Xenonauts is already digital distribution (as Gorlom points out) and the dvd would be a special, probably limited, edition. Personally I am happy with the digital version. If I feel the need for an install disk I will probably just back up the DRM free version myself. I wouldn't (and will not) buy a physical copy if it only comes in standard dvd case. Physical copies for me are premium goods - and thus the box needs to be premium quality as well. You know, something that I can proudly put on display next to other classics. Cheap piece of plastic has no value in it. That is the point I was trying to make, I know I didn't do it very well. It would need to be a really impressive box for me to make space on my bookshelves for it. Otherwise I only have space for dvd cases. Edited May 13, 2012 by Gauddlike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashman Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Survey has hit an 1100 response limit.. DOH!! Ok guess we will get some results soon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shima Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Just 1100 responses? That's quite small sample. Well at least we'll get to see the results fast Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashman Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 it would cost Chris an Extra 0.15p a response to if all 1900 backers replied Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
targetbsp Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 (edited) So youre saying if a indie musician press and prints his own CD,s to save money beacause its cheapen than to outsource it, you will pirate his album? Yes that's exactly what I was saying lol. How on earth did you read that into what I said?? And have you ever heard of iTunes? Personally it's irrelevant to me because I'm too old to listen to new music! My point still applies to music though. If I am paying an amount of money just to obtain the music then I'm not fussed how it is presented to me. I'm buying the music, not the packaging. If however I am specifically choosing to pay a premium especially for a box - then yes I want that box to be a quality product. [edit] Oh I think you misread the bit where I said I may as well just download it and print it. Note the part 'download and PRINT'. I was talking about box artwork. Not the product. Edited May 13, 2012 by targetbsp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorlom Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 (edited) [edit] Oh I think you misread the bit where I said I may as well just download it and print it. Note the part 'download and PRINT'. I was talking about box artwork. Not the product. Oh.... I thought you were talking about money. I already called the authorities. I probably should call them again and tell them it was a false alarm. Edited May 13, 2012 by Gorlom Changed FBI to authorities since I don't know if targetbps is American or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashman Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 I wouldn't (and will not) buy a physical copy if it only comes in standard dvd case. Physical copies for me are premium goods - and thus the box needs to be premium quality as well. You know, something that I can proudly put on display next to other classics. Cheap piece of plastic has no value in it. As someone who spent 15years of his life in and around the media/production and distribution business, with my father doing it every day and my brother as well. Making physical copies of the game is a real gamble and could potentially costs 1000's to implement and waste. People do not realize the gamble involved. This is because of minimum production runs usually come in batches of 100. Even the production and shipping of a Standard PC box DVD involves Case insert design- Artist time to make something unique or re-size assets to fit. Disc Design - As above Artist time Finalizing Gold Master DVD -testing Q&A of said master to ensure your not printing 1000 coasters. Cost of the case Cost of the DVD Cost of making a manual B&W or colour- Artist time- designer time- pulling it together, might take 1 person a week or 2 to do it properly with such a complex game- Why do games no longer have manuals? Because the cost of this is upto 4/5 times the price of duplication. (ask anyone who has gotten married and need 200 2page order of services) Production run involving- the making of case insert - putting in case - burning DVDs and printing/laminating them - Printing and inserting manual - Not of it is free. If you want the printing to be a higher quality or involve using more than 4 colours - double the price. Whats that you want a cloth map? That will be £4.99 at such a small production run. That extra poster another £1. Dont forget the cost of delivery to your distribution centre/house Now add the price to wrap the goods for postage. Add the cost of postage. Now add up all the time taken/spent doing all this, that is not spent on the game. Now imagine not everyone who said they would, went a ordered a box copy. You still have to do a minimum run. Stores will not stock excess games that have not gone through PEGI/BBFC and barcoded. Bloody expensive I can tell you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thothkins Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 it is a heck of a premium item to be getting involved in from scratch, even as they are trying to get an actual game finished and distributed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashman Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 it is a heck of a premium item to be getting involved in from scratch, even as they are trying to get an actual game finished and distributed. Someone like double fine has a larger studio, they have done this for years, they were making these boxes back in the 90's. However, it is a very expensive process and time a consuming process. Also they announced the boxed copy design and contents after they had 11500 orders. That is quite a number and came in at $100 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IceVamp Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Poll results are up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Posted May 13, 2012 Author Share Posted May 13, 2012 Yup, they're up now. I was hoping the tilesets wouldn't do so well because they're so much bloody work, but there we go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corporal Hicks Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Ahwn..... nooooo.... The Reaper Hive won't be in the game.... I really hope the mod community will take care of it!!! Crossing fingers... What happened to the Chrysalid??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilrathi Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Chris - any more thoughts on new reward tiers (signed versions of stuff - which would just require more signing but not more necessarily more postage, assuming you got to the U.S. to sign; digital art; etc.)? The stretch goals look great but it takes a lot of downloads at $30 to make up a $25k stretch goal... seems like there are people out there willing to bump their pledges if they have the opportunity to do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoMask Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Ah dang it D: I hope you read our conversation in proposed stretch goals thread and consider adding reaper hive in a way that makes you guys do less work(we were talking about how you can ignore doing damaged tiles for reaper hive because... Well, you'll see if you check the thread). I mean, yeah, tilesets are painful to do, but they add lots of variance in the game which is awesome. UFO Alien Invasion has large pool of set maps which game randomly chooses from, but because pool is so large you don't get same map too often so it feels pretty awesome. But yeah, please consider adding reaper hive in some form ^^; Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingdisc Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Glad to see that the Soviet city scape is set at one of the easier to reach stretch goals I imagine that this tileset would be a better fit for 1970s terror missions in Coventry (UK) than the current American one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoMask Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Still kind of confused why reaper hive got lowest out of all map/tileset ones .-. I mean, its most unique out of them all... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorlom Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 (edited) People probably didn't think the hive would be fun. They are afraid. so very afraid of the endless spawning zombie huggers! BAH I was hopeing tall grass and proximity grenades would win over Vehicle experience. And I'm still worried that the description about vehicle experience isn't clear enough. Edited May 13, 2012 by Gorlom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoMask Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 I was hoping that motion detector would be among lower ones and pilot picture one higher. But yeah, I'm probably going to create thread at suggestion section about possible ways to make Reaper Hive take less work if indestructible tile suggestion isn't enough/developers just don't want to do indestructible tileset. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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