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[1.65/X.CE V0.35.0] X-Division 1.00 Beta (1.00.11c)

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Thanks! What are the fixed researches that I will miss out on if I attempt to patch from .01 to .10?

 

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15 minutes ago, lolo said:

Thanks! What are the fixed researches that I will miss out on if I attempt to patch from .01 to .10?

 

Antimatter Technology 2 is not unlockable in the current version .01. This doesnt keep you from getting Antimatter Technology 1,3 and 4 though. The armour progression has been stretched so that some armours are faster reachable, while others have a more logical progression. The goal was to better distribute armour research so you get enough time to play around with a new armour before the logically next one gets unlocked. Some roborex dependencies were removed which made 1 armour not unlockable. A data hack had an inappopriate, but still researchable requirement. A few fixes all around the board. Additionally the research was optimised for Palus Shining Xenopedia.

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@Larry BurstynI think you requested something like better visible facehuggers for your eyes:

Into C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Xenonauts\assets\mods\X-Division: aiprops.xml

This removes the ghost ability, which means facehuggers will create an visible icon on the right sight for you.

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On 11/12/2018 at 7:59 AM, Charon said:

@Larry BurstynI think you requested something like better visible facehuggers for your eyes:

Into C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Xenonauts\assets\mods\X-Division: aiprops.xml

This removes the ghost ability, which means facehuggers will create an visible icon on the right sight for you.

Thank you.  And my eyes thank you also.

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There some kind of AI issue, as i think. Non-combatants always pushing to my guys guns and die from reaction fire, in the same time guards and other military ETs guys hidding deep in the ship and never rush.

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On 11/3/2018 at 4:58 PM, Charon said:

@Dagar @PALU @Svinedrengen

Give me some quality of life changes you would like to see in X-Division and which cant be possibly modded in.

Just out of curiosity, did you want that for a possible mod of Xen2nauts? Or for something else?

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The Schockdamage feature is a pretty good addition to the game, it makes the shotguns a little more than just a niche weapon with stundamage, it is still a niche weapon just better now, and it gives the locals with shotguns an actual chance to defend themselves, although it is still a very small chance. 

SMG's are now a viable option instead of pistols, but they still need a little more to make them a truly legit option. I have been thinking about lowering their TU usage from 40% to around 30-33% so when you dont move, you can fire 3 times. It would make them good for breaching and controlling small areas. What do you think? @Charon

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23 minutes ago, Svinedrengen said:

SMG's are now a viable option instead of pistols, but they still need a little more to make them a truly legit option. I have been thinking about lowering their TU usage from 40% to around 30-33% so when you dont move, you can fire 3 times. It would make them good for breaching and controlling small areas. What do you think? @Charon

I looked at the situation and i dont think they need their % use lowered. Lowering the % use is the laymans first thought, but you have to keep the weapons unique. Whats so unique when every problem gets solved with lowering TU% ? Instead i think increasing the amount of bullets to a higher number and adjusting the clip capacity. From 6 to either 8 or 10 bullets and from 30 to either 32 or 40 bullets per clip. Hard to say which one is more appropriate.

But alas that is why we have a development team, you need to throughly test these changes in the short, medium and long run. X-Division was not build upon people trying to think out problems, but with hard statistical data to back up their decisions. X-Divisions work has been layed down, but if you want to improve on the SMGs that is the direction i would be looking at.

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17 minutes ago, Charon said:

I looked at the situation and i dont think they need their % use lowered. Lowering the % use is the laymans first thought, but you have to keep the weapons unique. Whats so unique when every problem gets solved with lowering TU% ? Instead i think increasing the amount of bullets to a higher number and adjusting the clip capacity. From 6 to either 8 or 10 bullets and from 30 to either 32 or 40 bullets per clip. Hard to say which one is more appropriate

Well the uniqueness (dont know if that is a word) would be that if you stayed put, you would get the ekstra shot, which would make SMG's good at very surtain situations. I did also think about more shots and ammocapacity, but in theory it just sounds more like a strait upgrade, and what is unique about that? ;)

Anyway I am definatly going to test both thinks to find out what works best, as I still think they need a little more of something. 

28 minutes ago, Charon said:

But alas that is why we have a development team, you need to throughly test these changes in the short, medium and long run. X-Division was not build upon people trying to think out problems, but with hard statistical data to back up their decisions. X-Divisions work has been layed down, but if you want to improve on the SMGs that is the direction i would be looking at

Ja I know, and that is exactly the reason why I wanted to hear your opinion on the subjekt. 

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Dunno how well the SMG does it right now, but maybe alternatively you could look into it suppressing a bit more. A CQ high reflex one handed suppression weapon would be pretty cool to have. Of course it should not suppress as reliably as the LMGs or miniguns do.

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2 hours ago, Charon said:

@Svinedrengen

For now i have increased the bullet per burst from 6 to 8 and clip capacity from 30 to 40. I also adjusted the accuracy of the gauss smg.

Edit: strings.xml weapons.xml weapons_gc.xml

Awesome, going to try this when get home later. 

 

@Dagar they do have decent suppression power already, I dont want them to become too powerful, all I want is to make them a truly legit option to pistols, and as it is now their not, which leaves no point in using them and that is a bit of a shame. But your right, it would be cool to have a weapon like that, maybe too cool. 

Edited by Svinedrengen
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2 hours ago, Dagar said:

Dunno how well the SMG does it right now, but maybe alternatively you could look into it suppressing a bit more. A CQ high reflex one handed suppression weapon would be pretty cool to have. Of course it should not suppress as reliably as the LMGs or miniguns do.

The problem that the SMG has it is never truelly the weapon of choice. If you want to deal damage you go for a pistol. If you want to be highly manouverable after shooting you take a pistol. If you want suppression than you usually take an hmg because of the longer range and better suppression. It doesnt help you one bit to 80% suppress a target, but to need support from others to finish the suppression job. It doesnt help that neither the damage, the suppression nor themanouverability is something an SMG can achieve without the support of other weapons. There is basically not a single outstanding feature for an SMG. Yet if we buff them too hard by even a hairs breath they can easily become the next meta.

I hope with the addition of the SHOCK effect the weapon gets more a niche of its own, while the increased bullets dont really increase the damage because of the abysmall accuracy anyway, but it increases the damage a bit in point blank situations, which should give it a slight edge against pistols in point blank situations.

@Svinedrengen

Edited by Charon
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My experience with it is obviously limited, but I liked the Division SMG Mk1, and took it for my shielders over the ballistic or laser pistol of same level. To me it seemed like the only trade-off you have to take is that you cannot finegrain your shots that well, but for damage and suppression I deemed it pretty good.

If there was a laser SMG, I'd definitely tech and take it as is.

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2 minutes ago, Dagar said:

My experience with it is obviously limited, but I liked the Division SMG Mk1, and took it for my shielders over the ballistic or laser pistol of same level. To me it seemed like the only trade-off you have to take is that you cannot finegrain your shots that well, but for damage and suppression I deemed it pretty good.

If there was a laser SMG, I'd definitely tech and take it as is.

No SMGs until Phase 3 !

 

Not that you need it, every MAG weaponry has its own burst mode anyway ><.

Edited by Charon

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So, you want the SMG to be an alternative to the pistol. As already said, I have only limited experience with the later stages of the game, but I felt I already used the SMG well as an alternative to the pistol as it is. Where it fell flat for me was when there was no early energy-based version of it when energy by and large is preferable to kinetic due to less resistance on the alien's side. But just comparing kinetic, by taking an SMG instead of a pistol you trade in damage and mag capacity for the chance to suppress. As always, you need to build your team around that, but it is definitely not as if the SMG is inferior to the pistol. I like to run assault rifle squads, and these rifles are my main source of damage, usually. For that to work I need some shielders to protect the defenseless rifles until they get close enough to reliably hit. I can (and do in the early game) suppress with LMGs and then get close, but I could also see myself swapping one of the two LMGs I currently bring for something else, if I have the close range suppression capability of two SMGs on my shielders instead.

Sure, that's not perfect for every situation, especially on open maps like desert or arctic I would still prefer LMGs, but for towns and jungles I'd switch anytime.

What I mean to convey here is that since pistols are a reflex bonus close range damage centered weapon, SMGs should not become the same thing. If a pistol is the close range counter part to an assault rifle, the SMG is the same thing for LMGs, and that is a good thing that should be preserved.

I could also see myself utilizing the reflex bonus of a melee weapon in the main hand with an SMG in the off hand for suppression and damage. If it now additionally gives TU drain (SHOCK or what did you call it?), all the better for me.

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Hello. I am again with interrogation and QoL problems. I see 1.10 compared with 0.99 have better catalogued ALIEN UNIT info. 

How about to transfer interrogation info in its own category and make names look like "Ph1 Caesan medic" and align it by phase and race? 
Now i am only on mid 2nd phase and have 50+++ infos in ALIEN UNITS catalogue, it really hard to find missed interrogation.

Second, how about better structurised workshop list? All weapons manufacturing and dsb made very scattered, laser weapons stands near UFO DSB, when plasma at 10 lines upper from them, sometimes needed much time to find thing you need. All UFOs and corpses dsb can be made in same category, there is no so much classes of that. Weapons DSBs can be made by resourse class like ENERGY CORES\CHEMICAL CORES\ets.

Anyway, having category wreckages and wrekages&toxin pistols is pretty weird. When you have 5+ bases with team and workshops, game starting to be a manager hell.

Edited by Light Scout

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17 hours ago, Charon said:

The problem that the SMG has it is never truelly the weapon of choice. If you want to deal damage you go for a pistol. If you want to be highly manouverable after shooting you take a pistol. If you want suppression than you usually take an hmg because of the longer range and better suppression. It doesnt help you one bit to 80% suppress a target, but to need support from others to finish the suppression job. It doesnt help that neither the damage, the suppression nor themanouverability is something an SMG can achieve without the support of other weapons. There is basically not a single outstanding feature for an SMG. Yet if we buff them too hard by even a hairs breath they can easily become the next meta.

Exactly my point. 

 

@Dagar I would not compare 1 handed weapons with 2 handed ones, but if I absolutly had to, I would compare them both to riffles. The 2 only things SMG is better than pistols is supression and max damage. Suppression is not good enough, I would rather use flashbangs which costs around the same % TU as shooting once and it is more reliable. Damage is only better in point blank range. In all other catagories it is worse than pistols. 

With the new shock damage and more bullets, I might end up with issuing both the pistol and SMG to my shielders, pistol in the hand for the open fjeld and switch to SMG when breaching and clearing. And since they both take 6 squares, I can fit it in the belt with 1 ekstra clip for each, for quick and low TU cost switch. 

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Please, give an answer for a noob, what is the true purpose of division weapons (except minigun and cannon). Lasers more multipurposed - caesans, not very big difference what damage type you have, but lasers have better accuracy. Sebs have weakness to lasers. Xenoms are dying from fire and fire is much better for this, reapers too.

So if you dont know the enemy type - choose lasers and fire.

In late ph1 and early ph2 division good against mechareapers, but its all. I see no any tasks for mgs (you have godlike minigun mk3), rifles, s-rifels and smgs and after little time you reasearch plasma and forget about damage problem at all.

Maybe if they would have lower price, i can equip garrisons and second teams with them...

Edited by Light Scout

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One very important reason for Division weapons is that they may become available earlier than lasers, depending on your luck with encountering researchable items and aliens, and the Mk-2/Mk-3 versions use kinetic cores rather than energy ones, so your choice may be not between Laser and Division, but between standard weapons and Division (I certainly had to wait for both to be able to provide the second half of my soldiers with better gear, but I run 6 teams, which is probably more than what's optimal). Personally I didn't start to use miniguns until I got access to armor that counter the heavy weapon effect, but used machineguns until then (and miniguns are heavy, while the powered armor carries its own weight). Machineguns have the advantage of being capable of firing two bursts in a round, and they're also fairly good at shredding cover so other units can hit them, and don't sneeze at the power of suppression, in particular against enemies with heavy weapons (it's quite possible energy machinguns are as good at these tasks as kinetic ones are: I haven't tried).

However, I lean heavily towards energy weapons, and typically use a heavy kinetic machinegun + vehicle kinetic machineguns plus one soldier with a kinetic rifle, with the rest being energy (although I'm finally able to use some of the "secret" tech weapons, and have some shock/EMP ones on my shield bearers).

I think kinetic weapons tend to deal a higher raw damage than their corresponding energy ones, which should make them better at wearing away shields (both physical ones and energy ones). The Roboreaper high energy resistance armor is extremely hard to take out with energy weapons (but a vehicle kinetic machinegun at point blank range works wonder, typically removing both the shield and energy armor layer in a single burst). You may, of course, chose to switch layouts depending on the target (when you gain the ability to determine what the craft crew is), and skip kinetic altogether when not needed. It can be noted that Harridans have much worse kinetic than energy protection, by the way.

Having said that, you should try to equip your soldiers according to how you play so you use weapons suitable for that tactic, not based on what someone else does.

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@Light Scout I think what @PALU said is a good summary:

1 hour ago, PALU said:

Having said that, you should try to equip your soldiers according to how you play so you use weapons suitable for that tactic, not based on what someone else does.

Apart from that on more difficult levels of X-Division you will have to use whatever you have at your disposal. In my playthrough i teched straight towards laser tech, but than the game gave me 90% sebillian missions, and i reluctantly had to tech towards Division weapons for an inbetween bridge until the game decided to let me get more energy cores. From a balanced 50/50 viewpoint you will not have the tech nor the resources to either skip Division weapons or Laser weapons entirely. I usually try to get my hands on energy damage, and substitute the long range suppression with Division weapons, because suppression doesnt care about damage type. Division Miniguns are almost as good as Laser ones at point blank range so you can substitute missing miniguns with some kinetic ones most of the time. Discs are quite vulnerable to kinetic miniguns, for once because of their size and secondly because of their low kinetic resistance.

The Laser weapons are definitely lacking in the suppression department, as they dont really have a dedicated hmg ( the Gatling is a LAB failure ). The newly introduced SHOCK effect for kinetic shotguns and smgs slightly give you more options on the kinetic side to consider. The cannons have some nice niche picks with their burst options and the ballistic sniper has more power and penetration than the Laser one.

I was still around when everybody was only using kinetic weaponry because on paper they simply had slightly more power and mitigation all around. Then .4 introduced the new androns with their high kinetic resistance and the meta shifted heavily towards energy weapons. The weapons themself didnt change, only the meta around them did, and so they became quite valuable.

As Palu said the most important point is that your team and your strategy is well rounded, so the prefered weapon loadout usually dictates what kind of damage type you need to bring to the battlefield.

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On 11/19/2018 at 12:32 AM, Light Scout said:

Anyway, having category wreckages and wrekages&toxin pistols is pretty weird. When you have 5+ bases with team and workshops, game starting to be a manager hell.

I have only one base, later two bases that handle all construction and stuff. Saves lot of hassle.

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Is it really intentional that the Sentinel armor can't be used with sniper rifles? What I mean with "can't be used" is that the number of TUs required to fire a sniper shot is higher than the maximum number of TUs (unless there's some later, unknown, development that allows soldiers to gain more than the previous maximum). It certainly throws a spanner in my troop layout strategy (although enemies being able to hit my sniper through a roof, while the sniper can't fire back due to a 100% blocking roof negates a large part of the "sniping from a high vantage point at the rear end of the map" strategy anyway). My laser sniper rifle required about 122 TUs, with the armor only providing 115.

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34 minutes ago, PALU said:

Is it really intentional that the Sentinel armor can't be used with sniper rifles? What I mean with "can't be used" is that the number of TUs required to fire a sniper shot is higher than the maximum number of TUs (unless there's some later, unknown, development that allows soldiers to gain more than the previous maximum). It certainly throws a spanner in my troop layout strategy (although enemies being able to hit my sniper through a roof, while the sniper can't fire back due to a 100% blocking roof negates a large part of the "sniping from a high vantage point at the rear end of the map" strategy anyway). My laser sniper rifle required about 122 TUs, with the armor only providing 115.

I think you are "forgetting" to point out that "cant be used" means the highest aim option cant be used, while the other 2 can still be used. Thats correct.

Apart from the fact that your snipers should already have decent accuracy with the first 2 options it is indeed to powerful to have a flying, relatively well armoured armour shoot 2 times. The side effect of this is that you cant use the highest aim option. You will need to use other, less potent snipers like the MAG Precision or the Pulse Precision one, which obviously are either less powerful or have less range. Or you climb the house like a normal human being, by foot.

Edited by Charon

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No, I'm not "forgetting": that's what "sniper shot" was intended to mean, together with the quotes around "can't be used". Looks like it's time to go in the complete opposite direction and use a Ripper armor on the snipers (assuming I can meet the rather hefty resource requirements).

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