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[1.65/X.CE V0.35.0] X-Division 1.00 Beta (1.00.11c)


Charon

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@Dapifer

Hell...a lot of things.

Maybe I'm just a long time JA2 player, and that is the reason, but weapon AP cost is too high..it makes a turn too rigid, too...arcade? I don't know exactly how to describe that feeling. It just doesn't leave room to maneuver. In vanilla game that is exactly the same as in X-Division, but at least in vanilla accuracy of the weapons wasn't quite so nerfed. Makes me feel that I can't shoot a side of a barn with a machinegun (and that's a soldier with high accuracy). I guess this is done to somehow make weapons be different, give some progress to new and new weapons. The fact is that Xenonauts is not complicated enough to introduce much content without making it too similar. JA2 is 18 years old, and it has more of the mechanics to differentiate tons of weapons, which 1.13 mod illustrates amazingly. Obviously JA2 has it's limitations, but it's a much more complex game than Xenonauts.

This basically breaks the feeling of immersion for me. Realism I guess. However out of place expectation of realism is in a game. But playing JA2 1.13, and even earlier Wildfire mod, the feeling of immersion in combat is very much there. Obviously the systems of two games differ much, but nonetheless.

Now about XNT 6.0.

I don't know what exactly made it for me so immersive...tough aliens, requiring shooting them with tens of bullets before they went down, unpredictable behaviour of aliens..the combat just felt streamlined, all parts just working in unison to create that intangible but very much real feeling of immersion. Aliens felt ALIEN, just like in the original UFO: Enemy Unknown with it's spooky music.

I guess I'll never know what makes that game THAT for me. I guess the creator of XNT 6.0 and I have similar tastes in games and perception of what they should be. Albeit I lack the skills and know-how to actually create something like that.

To summarize, X-Division basically breaks that feeling for me from the get-go, whereas XNT keeps it very much alive and thriving. Therefore I don't want to experience a moment more of the X-Div, and I want more and more of XNT 6.0 (it's a pity that a mod as good as that is not finished).

Thanks for asking me this. Lets me share more of my impression of the game. Hope I kinda somewhat answered your question a bit. :) Ask more if there's anything at all.

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@trueman11 i take it you did not play more than a few missions of xdiv 99.41? because if you had, you would know that much of the content from xnt had been included in xdiv. the fact that xdiv does not cut it for you is ok, but it would be nice to play it more than a few turns if you want to form an opinion alas you have no way to know how much content there is and how similar it is or not. also you may be missing a lot of the more subtle things from the game. don't get me wrong, criticism is ok, but it would be even nicer if it were to the point. it could actually help. 

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2 hours ago, Phoenix1x+52 said:

@trueman11 i take it you did not play more than a few missions of xdiv 99.41? because if you had, you would know that much of the content from xnt had been included in xdiv. the fact that xdiv does not cut it for you is ok, but it would be nice to play it more than a few turns if you want to form an opinion alas you have no way to know how much content there is and how similar it is or not. also you may be missing a lot of the more subtle things from the game. don't get me wrong, criticism is ok, but it would be even nicer if it were to the point. it could actually help. 

Seems, that you missed my point completely, Phoenix1x+52.

I am pointing out that CONTENT DOESN'T MATTER, when there is no feeling of immersion. I tried to describe that feeling, maybe poorly, I don't know. But my point is exactly this – this is not an opinion, this is an impression. It doesn't come from analysis, from thinking things over, it comes from immediate experience.

I can not imagine more to the point and more subtle subject than feeling from the game.

Hey, maybe that's the difference exactly. You just can't get what it is for me in XNT, and I can't get what you are finding in X-Div. It's just individual perception.

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2 minutes ago, trueman11 said:

I am pointing out that CONTENT DOESN'T MATTER

yes it does. but you did not answer my question about how much of it did you experience in order to form an impression.

 

3 minutes ago, trueman11 said:

It doesn't come from analysis, from thinking things over, it comes from immediate experience.

if you only played for a few minutes and decided that is not your thing, well, it would be like making a review of a movie after watching the trailer. i do not believe it to be so relevant. 

on the other hand, if you played the whole game and than decided on how you feel about it, we would gladly accept not only your opinion but also a more indepth review so that we can improve the experience. 

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28 minutes ago, Phoenix1x+52 said:

yes it does. but you did not answer my question about how much of it did you experience in order to form an impression.

Sorry, thought that was obvious from what I wrote. I didn't find in X-Div the same feeling that I found in XNT from the get-go, as I wrote. Can't see the point of playing a game when I can't enjoy it immediately.

So are you arguing?!)) I am just expressing how it feels for me, and for me content is definitely not in the first place. For example there is much less content in UFO: Enemy Unknown, but I'll find there much more immersion, than in X-Div. Regardless of content.

For you it might be different, I'm not denying that.) But it is like this for me.) To each his own.)

28 minutes ago, Phoenix1x+52 said:

if you only played for a few minutes and decided that is not your thing, well, it would be like making a review of a movie after watching the trailer. i do not believe it to be so relevant.

I do not need to see the whole movie to feel if I am enjoying it.)) I guess we are coming at this from opposite perspectives.) I am writing about FEELING IT, and you are about ANALYZING IT. For me the only way to experience anything is TO FEEL it. Nothing can be experienced through analysis, thinking is always dead.

See, I am not saying anything about the game, so there is no need to protect it's reputation, or sth)).. I am just sharing my impression.))

And I am sure there is a rare person out there who will understand what I am writing about.)

28 minutes ago, Phoenix1x+52 said:

so that we can improve the experience

I am afraid that is impossible.) This mod is too different at it's core, and it would take a modder who can understand what I am writing about, to really get it there for the ones like me (seeing as I am too incompetent for that myself). Seeing that you obviously not getting what I am going on and on about..neither does Charon apparently..so...) Yeah..))

P.S. You can continue repeating yourself all you want, your analysis just can not apply to my feeling.))

Edited by trueman11
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6 minutes ago, trueman11 said:

I am writing about FEELING IT, and you are about ANALYZING IT. For me the only way to experience anything is TO FEEL it. Nothing can be experienced through analysis, thinking is always dead.

well, i cannot and will not argue feelings. i was just hoping for a more precise description of what drove you off. as for the reputation, you should not talk about the core of it when you have not reached it. it is simply shallow. but i guess it is your prerogative after all to like or dislike anything based on whatever criteria you see fit. 

 

13 minutes ago, trueman11 said:

And I am sure there is a rare person out there who will understand what I am writing about.)

well, obviously i am not that one :) so what can i say, good luck playing jagged alliance. De gustibus non est disputandum

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1 minute ago, Phoenix1x+52 said:

you should not talk about the core of it when you have not reached it

That is exactly my point.))) For me this feeling IS the core of any game.)) If the game does not create it for me, then it is not for me.)

And exactly, for me analysis is shallow, unconnected to life, to the experience.))

To each his own I guess.))

4 minutes ago, Phoenix1x+52 said:

well, obviously i am not that one :) so what can i say, good luck playing jagged alliance. De gustibus non est disputandum

Not on that one for the moment, but thanks:) You too, enjoy X-Div:)

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I cant run this mod 8(
I have installed all necessary mods. See on the picture below:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/kguiyth16b2ymwx/Screenshot_20171019_045815.png?dl=0

After startup, I get an error:
'Manu.XAircraft9' is not manufacture category
name (Name='ManTech.MiG32')
See on the picture:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/g9isydz39wrrgc4/Screenshot_20171019_045731.png?dl=0

What could it be?
Thanks.

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14 hours ago, Phoenix1x+52 said:

not broken, i just did not have the time to write the strings for them. that is the text description is a sort of placeholder, but the rest is working fine. 

Confirm these xenos gives chitin. But roboreaper not gives cores. Can you tell what and numbers it should give pls? I will fix it by myself.

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It's funny, but I played a month ago in ja2 1.13 for a long time, and even added new types of ammo and weapon stuff for the game. Both games with mods are good in their own way. And the x-division has no problems with the transfer of the feeling of the original game, to which I played more than 20 years ago. I think it's just aliens kick your ass hard... so gitgud (c) :)

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On 18/10/2017 at 3:43 PM, trueman11 said:

I tried to play this one...after playing XNT 6.0 and it's dynamic ground combat, I just can not play this one... My impression is that the ground combat is TERRIBLE. Even worse than in vanilla game. Of course that is just my impression, to each his own, but that is my impression nonetheless.

XNT 6.0 is buggy as hell, and eventually those bugs made it for me unplayable...but those few hours captivated me completely. Even despite the bugs. It just had that original feeling of immersion from UFO: Enemy Unknown...that will stay with me forever.

The feeling that X-Division did not continue for me.

The differences between the XNT 6.0 and X-Division 0.99.41 are huge, obviously. But for me content for content's sake is simply pointless. I do not feel this game, at all. And I FELT the XNT 6.0 in my bones. Immersion is invaluable, and content just simply can not replace it. For me. Obviously.

Few games have that captivating quality for me, very few. And XNT 6.0 is one of them. Not the X-Division though. Not AT ALL.

P.S. The new content is probably great. From what I've seen it is so. But without immersion...no point, just no point.

P.P.S. Just to compare, Jagged Alliance 2 1.13 is a great example of MUCH content and immersion coexisting.

I strongly disagree. Although its been ages since i dont play XNT (Since i discovered X division!), I got enchanted with this mod at the very first moment. I love the wide variety of weapons, research and so.

There are two main drawbacks for me in X DIV.

1.- I find it too slow, there are many times i play the ground missions quite bored just for farming. But otherwise i love this mod. 

2.- I BEG for many more Alien races! Not only many variants of the same unit. I really appreciate the inclusion of robodogs and many many new subtypes of units, and i know there are many. But if i can ask, i demand more. PS: Alien Tanks, really? Are Aliens in WW2?

Anyway, im interested in your point of view. Do you think you could post some comparative analysis between both mods? I want to know more of what XNT excells at in comparisson to X Div.

Thanks and regards!

Edited by Juvilado
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On 10/19/2017 at 0:07 AM, trueman11 said:

 

SOMEONE WITH A DIFFERENT OPINION OH MAH GAWD BURN THE WITCHHH, in a hindsight i could hardly imagine someone not being immersed in x-division like it did for me. but everyone has his own opinion i suppose

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@Juvilado

I don't disagree with that content is good and whatever little I saw I enjoyed, and frankly was looking forward to discovering all of the new content. BUT. The ground combat's pace is a deal breaker for me. So my disappointment is because of this I don't get to enjoy all of that new content. And for me ground combat is half the game. And I can't enjoy just one half.

About a comparative analysis – to swing that I'd need to play more of both mods, and one being buggy as hell and the other is purely unenjoyable for me, I doubt I'm gonna do that. You could try XNT 6.0, I installed it with CE 0.34.3 just recently, and it at least did run with it. So I don't really know how buggy it'll be, cause I just checked if it'll run. I couldn't download XNT 6.0 from it's thread, so I got it from here (didn't install any other mods except Kabill's random map packs):

And as I wrote earlier, analysis isn't really my kinda thing:) Not anymore:)

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Hi there, just got done with phase 1 on normal - thought I should share my experiences and provide some insightful feedback. Thanks for the mod!

So; this is how the game has gone for me thus far;

  • A weak start for the airgame, though I'm gradually catching up (I've downed almost 30 alien fighters at this point.) {note: I'm using Easy Airgame since my reflexes are poor.}
  • I defended Athens from the first terror mission (which was androns {note: oh god, the bullet sponge roboreaper from hell,}) AND got both the caesan and seb early terror operators (Division Shotguns and Snipers FTW, also; I'm embarrassed to say it took 17 tries, five map rerolls and multiple TPKs). -- I soon realized this was a massive victory for only losing 4 Lt. and a Defender tank; I mean, seriously: andron corpses give me armour and cores, live terror operatives give me antimatter weaponry so I can assault alien bases before phase 2, then I can gain massive loot from the alien bases thanks to the high mitigation incendiary damage.
  • I lost a firebase to alien attack, then reclaimed it within the 48 hour time limit (thank the heavens for those antimatter snipers, miniguns, defender tank, fox and wolf armour). It took me a few tries before I realized the telepad room is the second to first place I should go through.
  • Managed to build a Shrike dropship a month before phase 2 began (I'm in love with these massively reduced time constraints.)
  • Defended Madrid on Oct.31st from a caesan terror op, but neglected a terror attack in Europe during December 3rd (I wanted to destroy the last standing alien base before it could flip.)
  • I strategically sold datacores in order to ensure I was breaking even for the first few months (the weak airgame on my end was making base maintenance rather costly.)
  • I've managed to train 8 rookies up to the rank of Lt. (it would've been 11 had 3 not died from my sleep-deprived mistakes.)
  • I've currently engaged in 39 [grounded] U-FO assaults, 2 [landed] U-FO assaults, 1 Base Defense, 2-of-3 Terror sites, and 2 Base Assaults.
  • My main base is currently situated in Armenia, with bases at Yellowstone, Vladivostok, and the East Amazon. Australasia and Greenland are currently undefended sections of earth.
  • The policy on encounters w/ new aliens (aka use the Div-2 Shotgun on em' about 13 times) has had a resounding success with wraiths, xenomorphs, and sebs.
  • Toxin grenades and shotgun-through-the-door methods have proven massive success against organics (the AI really likes sitting on the door tiles, and xenomorphs run through multiple gassed tiles before reaching a waiting shotgunner.
  • As for AI; Xenomorphs express Hit-N-Run + Wolfpack Tactics w/ Queens expressing some form of frontline command role. Caesans are best to engage during the first half of Phase 1 due to their frailty and steady movement patterns (don't underestimate them because you can O-HKO them, they've got decent Defense-in-Depth & Flanking tactics + a lucky Officer might win the RNG for mind-controlling one of your people.) Buzzard Armour renders most Phase 1 reapers null since you can spot them from the comfort of roofs and treetops (don't let seb flamers get close though; they'll melt you into scrap.) Sebs aren't big on flanking, so I walk past them and perform Hit-n-Runs as to trick the AI into making a mistake. Harridans... Harridans use a "Feinting Retreat" style of fighting, in order to beat them; you need to follow them carefully and keep them suppressed - make one mistake and someone dies - advance too quickly and a reaper or flamer-seb will ambush your people.
  • Overall; I find ground-combat extremely enjoyable with base-type missions and terror missions acting as difficult puzzles to solve. As for the strategic layer; I enjoy the difficult decisions and choices I have to make in order to stay slightly ahead of the curve, with finances taking a minor preference over resources, and rewards for a successful gc gambit having tremendous effect on my successes.

In conclusion, all I can say is this: Move with caution, be persistent, press the advantage, don't make any given mistake twice, and peel the enemy like an onion.

That's all and I hope everyone is having as much fun as I am! Good day~

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On 10/18/2017 at 11:32 AM, trueman11 said:

@Dapifer

Now about XNT 6.0.

I don't know what exactly made it for me so immersive...tough aliens, requiring shooting them with tens of bullets before they went down, unpredictable behaviour of aliens..the combat just felt streamlined, all parts just working in unison to create that intangible but very much real feeling of immersion. Aliens felt ALIEN, just like in the original UFO: Enemy Unknown with it's spooky music.

I guess I'll never know what makes that game THAT for me. I guess the creator of XNT 6.0 and I have similar tastes in games and perception of what they should be. Albeit I lack the skills and know-how to actually create something like that.

To summarize, X-Division basically breaks that feeling for me from the get-go, whereas XNT keeps it very much alive and thriving. Therefore I don't want to experience a moment more of the X-Div, and I want more and more of XNT 6.0 (it's a pity that a mod as good as that is not finished).

Thanks for asking me this. Lets me share more of my impression of the game. Hope I kinda somewhat answered your question a bit. :) Ask more if there's anything at all.

Well nice to see people geting the point of pure XNT mod.

Yes XNT is more about immersive cosmetics, flexible combat, AI of some aliens are changeling dealing with and the way to get rewards is based on effort. I remember dealing with Heavy monster crew early game, like Queens and Blade Beast, they can be mind blowing but not impossible, in XNT harder you involve in combat bigger the reward... So if you abuse explosives you can lost valuable bodies and stuff (that in this game could be dangerous for your own crew).

The combat mechanic in XNT vs XDIV are quiet different, the calculations of AP, accuracy and actions dynamics are totally far away.

XDIV has tons of quality content, I strongly believe that this only need direction, exclusive research branches (Lock or unlock some researches, the mount of research and manufacture for me is too big and confusing, there is no real statistical differences between some weapons) and more history line events that guide the game to multiple resolutions or endings.

Nice to say hello here and goo job to all XDIV developers. 

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