Why do people like this game so much?

[Thefunkbox]

OK... so I've played a bit of the newest version, and I just can't get into it. To me, the graphics are flat, there is nothing to draw me in, I have a lot of screen with very little information on it both during the waiting phase and the battle phase.

I had read rave reviews about this game, and bought it based on that. Having played X-com and loving it, I thought for sure this would be a notch above, and to some people it seems to be.

So my question is, in your opinion, what makes this game great? This is a genuine question. I'm not trying to be sarcastic or anything. I just want to read some other views so maybe I can figure out the element I'm missing. Right now I just don't get what's special about it.

[KevinHann]

Which X-com have you played?

[Teodosio]

This game is basically the pro version of XCOM (enemy unknown). It is a shame that it has some very unpleasant bugs (look in the bugs subforum).

[kabill]

Honestly, I'm not sure. X-Com has always been one of my most favorite games and, aside from some missing atmosphere, Xenonauts is X-Com but better.

With that said, I actually think I enjoy modding the game more than playing it, so the fact that there's a lot of mod potential is a big draw for me. Indeed, I've probably spent more time modding, mapping and testing over the last three months than I have playing, so maybe that's the key thing for me? Not much help for you, though. Indeed, if you're not enjoying it, it might just be that the game isn't for you.

[ViewThePhenom]

Sure, it's not pretty. But I love the setting, the level of control that you have over your units, the level of challenge in both the ground combat and the geoscape, the feeling that Geoscape strategy actually matters and being free to figure out how to make my preferred builds work. Plus, the game mechanics are solid, AI is great overall and actually fits the units pretty well, nice clean UI, a real sense of hard decisions to be made in terms of keeping funding blocs in the game, etc.

It may just not be your type of game, though. I know the lack of glamour will be a big turn-off for many and it does take a bit of time to get comfortable with everything, especially Air Combat and how to approach the Geoscape.

Edit:

The modding community is AMAZING, which pretty much guarantees awesome additional content, especially with the source code being opened up to the most dedicated. Just check the mod thread now and see how much work has gone into the game; this was being completed even before release!

Edited June 19, 2014 by ViewThePhenom

[Thefunkbox]

OK. That's actually very helpful! I have never been a big modder, but I have played a few Civ mods, and they can be really fun. Hopefully with some play through I will get into it more.

I do think the graphics are a part of the turn off for me right now. X-com feels complete and polished, and this feels like a throwback, but from what I can tell, that's intentional.

That having been said, there seems to be a bit more of a strategic element in the ground battle system, and that is something I find very appealing.

I have been playing X-com Enemy Unknown, and steam is running a sale on the sequel, so those may tide me over for a while.

Sorry for the disjointed thoughts. Papa Murphy's computer system didn't want to play nice tonight, and I'm waiting extra long for my pizza!

[Dandywalken]

The setting and mod potential are what I enjoy. By default, the attempts to stick so close to the old XCOM in terms of tactical combat etc (and willingly inheriting what many see as flaws/poor game design) just for the sake of re-living an old game are a detriment to enjoyment. So I mod to have fun.

That people find things like "Rocket goes errant and hits small wall you're hiding behind instead of window you were aiming at" to be any sort of enjoyable memory rather than one frowned at and best avoided, and the whole "Mind control anywhere on the map" solely because it was in the original XCOM is silly in my opinion. Though these are no doubt features the community requested. These are memories that are somehow attributed to XCOM as a series, on the same level as base design and deep Geoscape gameplay.

Why they are lauded somehow rather than felt best removed/modified, I will never know.

EDIT: To below dude: JA2 kicked all sorts of ass. A magnificent game. Shame the tactical combat in Xenonauts cant be a bit more like it, but then again... you never know. The modding potential is absolutely tremendous!

Edited June 19, 2014 by Dandywalken
Elaboration

[screeg]

I never played original X-com, but Jagged Alliance 2 has always been my favorite strategy game. Xenonauts definitely pushes a lot of the same buttons. I also enjoyed XCOM, but to me that's still the Fisher-Price version of X-com.

[ViewThePhenom]

I'm pretty sure Mind Control was nerfed to be Line-of-sight only. The errant rocket hitting the wall in front of you can be pretty easily avoided by standing in front of the window...unless I'm completely missing the problem there?

[dpelectric]

I came here straight from many games of XCom EU/EW, and I'll be the first to agree that the "flat" graphics and lack of animated sprites were difficult to adjust to. Xenonauts definitely doesn't have the same visual appeal.

But then I learned what others on this forum already knew: graphics take a distinct backseat to superior AI. Not to mention air combat. And the far more flexible TU-based movement system. And controlling and defending multiple bases. And the capacity for mappers to create anything.

XCom may be more "fun" and exciting, but Xenonauts is definitely the more demanding, challenging, and ultimately rewarding game

[Dandywalken]

I'm pretty sure Mind Control was nerfed to be Line-of-sight only. The errant rocket hitting the wall in front of you can be pretty easily avoided by standing in front of the window...unless I'm completely missing the problem there?

I'm almost 100% positive that mind control and other psionics are just flat-AP/TU costs that aliens with the appropriate class to use them can fire off every X-number of turns at cost.

And by the rocket thing I mean... its a bit hard to describe.

You're firing a rocket at a window from behind a small waist-high wall, or whatever height. Enough to provide cover. Firing at that window you'd assumedly be able to clear the other small wall thats 6 tiles ahead of you, or else your rocket would have had to be flying wildly off-course to hit the obstruction somehow. Instead, the rocket hits that small wall which it should have cleared, and rather than the rocket either hitting the window or hitting the wall near it, it instead has struck a small obstruction that it should have cleared. This is just due to how cover works though, and obstructions either blocking/not-blocking a shot I assume.

[StellarRat]

This game is basically the pro version of XCOM (enemy unknown). It is a shame that it has some very unpleasant bugs (look in the bugs subforum).

I've found not buggy at all. I haven't had a crash or game breaker in a long time. You make it sound worse than it is because you're running Linux. GH has acknowledged that Linux and Mac versions aren't completely done yet.

Edited June 20, 2014 by StellarRat

[Mathalor]

Psionic abilities do not need line of sight. Proximity makes them more likely to succeed. Aliens seem to use them once every other turn, until the firefight with that particular alien starts.

I hit a big bug where an alien shot through a solid metal corner a few squares away from him that was completely blocking my own unit's fire, and killed one of my guys. I consider it big because the one of the main appeals of the game seems to be the tactics of the ground map, and that kind of thing breaks it and makes me wonder what kind of different rules the aliens are really playing by.

It's not enough to make me stop playing, though.

[thixotrop]

I played the original (UFO: Enemy Unknown (in EU) or X-COM: UFO Defense (US), see here for more name details) back then on my Amiga 500 and loved it immensly. It was the first turn based strategy game for me. The later X-COM: Apocalypse was even better in my eyes.

I also, played the "clone" UFO: Aftermath (by Altar Games), which was quite good but also quite unfair after some time. I could not dig the other Altar Games UFO-parts.

As Firaxis announced their rebbot XCOM: Enemy Unknown I was eager getting my hands on this. They said they want to do a real game true to the original, they even mentioned that all development staff in their company should have to play the original before coding. Marketing gag or not, the will was there to do it.

As it was released I got it, and tons of bugs too. They stopped me playing for months. Remember that game is a A+ title, but it was a ridiculous buggy alpha release. I was furiously angry. After lot of patches I played it through and was very dissappointed. The game was sort of fun for a time but it was not the game I was looking for. It was not a true reboot, more an arcade game, with some low level strategy behind.

I liked in that version: ground combat optics (style & modern look, not so much the comic-book colors), ground combat tactical play (although limited to two actions only, so no retreat possible), base design concept, research, special missions, immersion of story.

I disliked: no real air combat, ground combat (triggered aliens instead of AI), camera and grenade throwing behaviour in ground combat, hugely repetitive maps, no soldier stats and K.O.-skill tree, money shortage for everything, one ground team only to choose one out of three missions ...and others. All this dislikes are coming from the reduction content to make the game more streamlined, polished and in general "good looking" without some real backbone to last for a want of re-play. Believe me I tried it but stopped it early.

Therefore no, I did not get the "Enemy Within" version.

Directly after that I found UFO:Extraterrestials (by Tristar Synergy) on Steam, and played it for some time, but could not dig into the blocky graphics anymore. Same happend for me as I installed the old X-COM: Apocalypse via Dos-box....ugly to my eye nowadays.

Xenonauts now was the first game that I ever have bought prior to release. Playing it since V18 and it is much fun since then. Despite the bugs, because I knew there where some, it was not an expensive A+ game. And you know what? The bugs where not stopping me for months. The graphics are not fancy in todays standard but very atmospheric, though comic-book because drawn over but more mature. BUt much more relevant, there is backbone, air combat, ground combat where you have to decide what to do and the results have affect on each other. So you have to wage what to do and how to do it. How many soldiers, what weapons, what euqipment, what jets, what researtch first, what to build, and so on.

Example: In ground combat you can choose different actions for one "problem". Shooting aliens, precision, normal or burst shot, do I have to save time for reaction fire? Do I use smoke, frag, flashbang or stun gas grenade? Can I retreat? All this can be combined in any way you like, not as the game wants you to.

Damn this is longer than I wanted it, so I stop here.

I hope you see what I mean: Some part "want the old game experience back" and some part "want to have a real turn based game and no shiny polished foam bubble".

FYI, I played XCOM: Enemy Unknown for 57 h (one play through, next stopped ) and Xenonaust now for more than 250 h (4 games in total, one completely through).

...maybe I am crazy.

[Mathalor]

Enemy within was fun for me, and seemed to fix some of it's parent's problems. It's still xcom lite, though.

Very much agree with the freedom of choice in how you tackle engagements. The firaxis version basically boils down to choosing your team comp and their accessories. Even changing up your map exploration strategy is difficult what with spotting aliens ruining your day, and the two actions per turn.

Edited June 20, 2014 by Mathalor

[crusherven]

To me a serious problem with the new XCOM is the virtually non-existent AI and the magically spawning aliens. It may be prettier, but the ground combat feels unfinished to me.

[Templer]

Why do people like this game so much?

I can't talk for all people, but for myself.

Why I like it?

This unpleasant, oppressive, painful feeling of cardiac arrest out of UFO: Enemy Unknown / X-COM: Terror From The Deep, when an ET shoots at one of your men, and you, with bated breath anxiously hoping and praying that the shot goes wrong... this feeling is back!

[odizzido]

New x-com was good enough for a single playthrough, but it's a shallow and basic game where the only redeeming features are the music and presentation. Even the graphics on new x-com are pretty terrible compared to games which came out years before its release. If the game were on sale for two dollars I might get it....maybe. I am just glad I didn't buy it.

This game however gives you freedom to play how you want. You can use your time units how you wish, the cover system isn't a broken mess, aliens actually do their thing, civilians do their own thing(and even fight aliens, very cool), equipping your soldiers is based on str and you need to carry ammo as well so you need to decide what gear is important instead of having it already dictated to you. I could go on.

I think maybe the xcom remake MIGHT maybe be kinda okay if you have never played a game like this before but anyone looking for something with a little depth should just pass it by.

Now one thing I will say about this game that sucks so far is the total lack of patches on the front page. Where are they? Why are they so hard to get? I wanted the devs to keep their money instead of giving it to valve but if I cannot get my game patched I might just load that steaming turd and put in my steam key.

[Akrakorn]

New x-com was good enough for a single playthrough, but it's a shallow and basic game where the only redeeming features are the music and presentation. Even the graphics on new x-com are pretty terrible compared to games which came out years before its release. If the game were on sale for two dollars I might get it....maybe. I am just glad I didn't buy it.

This game however gives you freedom to play how you want. You can use your time units how you wish, the cover system isn't a broken mess, aliens actually do their thing, civilians do their own thing(and even fight aliens, very cool), equipping your soldiers is based on str and you need to carry ammo as well so you need to decide what gear is important instead of having it already dictated to you. I could go on.

I think maybe the xcom remake MIGHT maybe be kinda okay if you have never played a game like this before but anyone looking for something with a little depth should just pass it by.

Now one thing I will say about this game that sucks so far is the total lack of patches on the front page. Where are they? Why are they so hard to get? I wanted the devs to keep their money instead of giving it to valve but if I cannot get my game patched I might just load that steaming turd and put in my steam key.

http://www.goldhawkinteractive.com/forums/forumdisplay.php/9-Release-Announcements

They release a shit-ton of updates in a very short period of time. Are you perhaps not using the experimental branch?

[MrPyro]

http://www.goldhawkinteractive.com/forums/forumdisplay.php/9-Release-Announcements

They release a shit-ton of updates in a very short period of time. Are you perhaps not using the experimental branch?

He's not using Steam at all. That's the point.

To answer; Chris said he had packaged up the most recent updates and sent them out to GoG/Humble Bundle/Desura and is waiting for approval from them

[Dranak]

To elaborate further, Steam lets developers pretty much instantly push changes through. Many other services have to an approval process for updates, which makes them take longer. Desura is pretty infamous for their slow release of updates. Plus they've been pushing updates on Steam first since it's easier to revert them if they wind up breaking things.

[MrPyro]

To elaborate further, Steam lets developers pretty much instantly push changes through. Many other services have to an approval process for updates, which makes them take longer. Desura is pretty infamous for their slow release of updates. Plus they've been pushing updates on Steam first since it's easier to revert them if they wind up breaking things.

And also because in terms of downloading, Steam does a differential download that is therefore much smaller than re-downloading the entire game again (desura also offered this, but it was distinctly flaky as I recall)

[Thefunkbox]

Wow. Excellent feedback all around. Sounds like I need to put in some more time and open my mind a little.

For the most part, I didn't have a problem with X-com Enemy Unknown. I've enjoyed it immensely, although it seemed at times that if you had not advanced your troops or gear as fast as the game seemed to think you should, you hit a level where attacks came from EVERYWHERE and you had virtually no chance to survive, even if you had solid tactics.

Personally, I always found a bit of joy in the fact that the environments were fully destructable, so that added a big element for me. I'm in my 40s, and I remember the frustration of playing games that were limited in their interaction. Anything you did only affected the characters around you. Having a wall I'm using as protection get dissolved was shocking and interesting at the same time. I have seen this game does it as well, although the feeling is not the same when it happens.

I'm hoping the part of my brain that loves the strategy involved with Civilization will come to love this. I'm going to grumble every time I want to play it on my laptop, though. It's been my primary place for games, and this will be the first one that doesn't want to cooperate. From a design standpoint, I think having so much "useless" stuff on the screen (meaning an element that is not functional in any way) is silly. For example, on the map screen, if the graphics in the bottom corners were removed, then that leaves more room for text and information. While a lot of people game on sizeable machines, there are a few of us that make do with something a bit more compact.

[Chris]

Yeah, there's a certain amount adjustment required before you get into the game. The graphics are acceptable but nothing special, and it can take a little while to get used to the intricacies of how it all works.

Also, bear in mind that some people just don't like certain games - it's not necessarily a slight on the game nor that person's taste in games. There's a number of critically acclaimed games that I thought would be right up my street, but I didn't enjoy them as much as expected....perhaps that has / will happen to you with Xenonauts? Nothing wrong with it if so.

[sectoid]

Why do people like this game so much?

Because it is not a dumbed down console game.