Base Defense

[Chimplicker]

I like the idea of security camera, would allow you to see everything thats going on, until they get destroyed of course.

[GrumpySage]

The fastest way to develop the feature of having base defenses shoot when the UFO approaches, would probably be to hook into the air combat system (as mentioned in the OP). Put the base in the middle (stationary of course) and let the goal of the UFO(s) be to reach it. Then give the player access to weapons on the right-hand bar, like when doing air combat.

So as a player you only have to choose when the weapons should be fired and at what. The problem I see with having less variables (that only one side is moving and has a set destination) is that it might lead to optimal strategies (such as fire one big salvo against large UFOs and fire in volleys against smaller).

Only damaging and not destroying a UFO should still give some benefit, such as slightly less aliens or some being wounded.

Edited November 9, 2011 by GrumpySage
Clarification & being a nub

[Gauddlike]

I really can't see that type of mission being interesting.

It would just be a case of selecting all the weapons, targeting the enemy then clicking fire.

As much as I do prefer to have some control over combat I think in this case it doesn't add anything fun.

Security cameras would be interesting.

Make them pan side to side with a 45 degree movement per turn and you would never be quite certain where the enemy you spotted last turn has gone.

You have the home turf advantage in so far as you can place your troops within certain areas to make your response as effective as you can.

The cameras would make things a little easier as well.

If they are quite hard to see and tricky to hit then they may serve you quite well.

[anotherdevil]

I would like to see an occasional base attack that's from an alien containment breach, rather than from an alien dropship/strike force attacking from the outside.

It would probably only work if the player had a live Chryssalid-like, psionic, or self-replicating alien in containment. The alien could infect or psi-control Xenonaut personnel, raid the armory, and attempt to either broadcast the base's location to alien forces or destroy the base outright.

This would suck.

'Oh hey guys, alien escaped. Now half your prized squad is taken over. Guess who gets to kill them!'

[Sathra]

Yeah, that would probably annoy far too many players. Mostly since it'd be almost completely random and happen out of nowhere.

[Yevgeniy]

Will there be an ammunition dump at the time of the protection framework, including ships armed?

[brad]

This would suck.

Thanks for the helpful and constructive feedback on my idea, it's much appreciated.

'Oh hey guys, alien escaped. Now half your prized squad is taken over. Guess who gets to kill them!'

It could be scientists who are taken over, not soldiers.

[Yevgeniy]

By the way, can manage technicians and scientists?

[anotherdevil]

Thanks for the helpful and constructive feedback on my idea, it's much appreciated.

That's quite alright. I realise that I did not write an essay on the matter, however sometimes giving an example is a much more appropriate way to illustrate a point. After all, was it not Einstein who said "Example isn't another way to teach, it is the only way to teach"?

It could be scientists who are taken over, not soldiers.

And your right, it could be scientists, or engineers, but then the mission wouldn't be any sort of challenge. Instead you would have to spend a few minutes killing men (the consequences of which are the cessation of important topics and a loss of money) who put up no real challenge. And why would they, they are the lab techs, armed with maybe a few old prototypes, and armoured with lab coats. What is that against armoured, professional soldiers with their uber-weapons?

[Lobster Man Commander]

If I use my imagination, I can see many ways to improve the immersion into this universe for the player. One clear example is to "upgrade" the random events that seams to happen all over the world though messages that show up in the lower-left corner of the map screen.

Scripted events like:

* Alien containment breaches, like Brad suggested.

* Rouge soldiers going on killing-spree -not subtracted from the goldenguys sent on every mission. Only later to be found out to be infected/mind controlled by the Aliens.

* Huge behemoth-type aliens that emerges and has to be taken out (think big Darksouls bosses)

* Pilot recovery missions that only happen once or twice due to the fact that Alien weapons are so destructive

* And so on... (there are probably hundreds of ideas for scripted events like these)

These one-time, Two-time events would arguably add to the tone of the game and increase immersion into the fantastic universe of planetary defense. Players would never know what the game is going to throw at him next! ...And That has serious immersion-factor.

But the major problem is that these things are extremely labor intensive development-wise. And sadly, can properly not be included at least at this stage of the Xenonauts-series... Yes its wishful thinking on my part, that this game will turn out to become a series but its the only thing a fan can really hope for

Maybe if Chris and the gang decide to make a new Xenonauts based on the hopefully high profits from this game, they could add extra content like this witch would improve the entire experience in my opinion.

Edited November 14, 2011 by Lobster Man Commander

[Sathra]

Aye, stuff that would be worth adding as a sequel.

The rogue soldiers one is interesting, do you mean as an actual mission, or just an event type?

I'm not sure about pilot rescue missions, I think Chris mentioned there could be something like that. Vaguely.

@Yevgeniy: I'm not clear what the first question was. I think you can equip soldiers before a base defense mission, but aircraft might not be involved (but they won't be in the defense mission itself. There won't be weapons lying on the ground in the mission however, its a bit messy and they'll be assumed to be safely stored away when not used.

For the second question, engineers and scientists are just numbers. They don't have names or stats, and play no part in ground combat missions. Probably. Might be a few in base defense, but its extremely unlikely.

[Elydo]

I figured their absence could be excused by having them run to and secure themselves within shelters within the base (built into existing rooms) before the attack landed.

EDIT: Or they could just have evacuated along with other non-combat staff, such as pilots, control room staff etc... Derp...

Edited November 14, 2011 by Elydo

[Lobster Man Commander]

Basic thinking for the rouge soldier idea:

Xenonauts operative/scientist/worker who has been subjected to an infection or otherwise subverted to the Alien side. This subjection has made him stronger and/or crazy, so a task force (anything from 2-12 agents) has to hunt him down and destroy him, or subdue him for inquiry/autopsy.

Some possible examples:

* Infection turned Xenonaut employee into a crazy and powerful opponent Like Hector Hammond - crazy scientist - from "The Green Lantern" the movie. (kill or subdue individual)

* Xenonaut employee infected by parasitic life-form like the chest-bursters of the "Alien" movies - (here the actual Alien might be the main target).

* Infection that has gradually zombiefied Xenonaut employee - inspiration: Anything from a zombie from a regular zombiefilm to a monster from "The Thing" or something more sinister like that (kill or subdue individual)

* Soldier has been exposed to extreme pressure and just turned plain old regularly insane. Could be in tactical mission, but would suck if he was killed and it turned out to be one of your favorite men.

Was thinking more in the lane of base defense, but I guess the idea could be implemented into any and every aspect of the game.

Anything from tactical missions to base defense or attack - to a pilot turned crazy in the middle of an interception. Wouldn't have to be a Xenonaut either. Could be a civilian or npc from one of the nations.

But the most important thing is that this sort of stuff has to be pretty rare not to work against its purpose, and that its clear in some way that its not going to be a regular thing. And that's really what makes it hard to implement in this game, as the effort that is put into something has to equal something that is valuable for the entire game to a high degree.

Edited November 14, 2011 by Lobster Man Commander

[Patupi]

How often in the game do other nations assist with NPC troops? Is it just local police or are there armed forces involved?

If the idea of one of your own soldiers (trained over months!) going postal, or zombied etc is too much you could get ONLY one of the NPC troops get affected. Could even be a separate mission 'Marines gone nuts at base 'X' ' and you go in to sort it out, rather than a situation during one of your 'normal' missions. Or both

[Chris]

I don't really want to add things like an alien breakout in your base. I think it's generally a bad idea to put random events like that in strategy games like these, as they'll generally become a chore over time and I think they'll just feel arbitrary rather than genuinely enhancing the mood of the game. The player has no chance to stop them happening, so it's just a bit unfair.

[anotherdevil]

What about some other missions within other missions (like surprise secondary missions!) Something like when you assault an enemy base you need to capture the leader (who is slightly more powerful) for extra xp, etc.?

[Gauddlike]

Reminds me of the SimCity events that would devastate the whole map after you had spent hours getting it to work properly.

No fun at all unless you are into that kind of self punishment

[Sathra]

AD, what you mentioned could just be a secondary objective. With the primary objectives being 'kill everything' and/or 'blow up the reactor/command center'

[anotherdevil]

I agree, but it could be another randomly assigned secondary mission that only occurs sometimes. Just saying, it could be nice to spice things up every now and then

[Sathra]

Oh yeah. Having some variety in secondary objectives would be good.

[thewatcher]

Ok but to bring the conversation back to what I was originally asking about. I would like thoughts on the locked door and base defense targeting.

Think of it this way, when an alien ship trys to land at my base, I would like to tell my base "try to destroy it out-right" or "try to take out its life support" so there are fewer aliens to face, or "dont fire..let them come!". If I research a ship (iv captured an aline and got the info) maybe some targets unlock, or become available (aka they have a higher chance of reaching the goal i set)

The doors, no base in the cold war era has doors that can be walked though by ppl outside of base personal. I would hope that aliens have to do something (spend a good chunk of time units) getting through doors in my base.

Now that where all back on topic ...

[Sathra]

They both got answered though.

Locked doors aren't that interesting, since at best the aliens would just shoot them out (which would involve the AI being able to understand the concept without shooting up every door they find).

As for specific base defense targeting, its boring. Compared to just shooting the bejeezus out of it till it explodes, and if it doesn't, at least reduce the numbers of aliens.

[Gauddlike]

The main problem I see with the doors is that you either close them and sit for x turns waiting for aliens to burn through them or open them to kill the aliens.

In the first case you will be losing valuable base facilities on the other side of that door.

In the second case why bother coding doors that the aliens see as a problem if you are just going to ignore them yourself anyway.

If they are purely there to allow you to pen the aliens up in hangers etc until you can get to them then it also defeats a lot of the concern a base defence should bring.

Rather than "Argh the aliens are rampaging through my base, scramble to defend!!1!" it becomes "Oh I have 10 aliens locked in a hangar? I will have a saunter along later and move them to the morgue".

I see the huge alien confounding doors as being on the outside of the base, by the time you are called on to defend they have already managed to get through those.

[Chris]

Buildings destroyed in the base defence missions will be destroyed on the Geoscape. This has to be balanced carefully though, else whatever building is closest to the entry point is always going to be destroyed in every mission, which wouldn't be fun.

For the doors only working for the humans, it would certainly make the base defence easier. I'm not sure if it's the kinda thing we want though. I guess it would add more protection to the buildings that could be destroyed but we'll have to make the doors destroyed pretty easily by alien weapons, and it might limit the game and lead to exploits of humans can use all the doors and the aliens not. Plus we'd have to think about how the AI worked in that situation.

Something to think about, but not necessarily to go in the game...

[anotherdevil]

There is also the problem of who cares if you knock out the life support in the ship. It's landing in the next few minutes, and all the aliens will disembark then. Same goes for weapons, and shields, etc. The simpler option of damage = dead aliens is much easier to grasp