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I have noticed a few issues with the visual aspects of the current grenade system (some of which might be bugs.) Issues: 1. When a grenade hits cover, there is no visual indication that it has done so. Particularly if it has landed on a tile where a soldier is already standing, such as the thrower. 2. When a grenade lands on a tile with an existing object, it disappears below it. Problem: Its really easy to get blown up by your own grenades as grenades more often than not hit adjacent cover, but there is no visual indication of where it has gone. Simply that it didn't go where it was supposed to. Solutions: 1. Introduce a visible arc line showing the path of the thrown grenade. The visual system is already in place and used prior to throwing and targeting. The visual indication would remain there until the grenade has detonated. That way its obvious where the grenade has gone, even if it has fallen under an object. I might suggest the line be white. OR 2. Introduce a fumble message to pop up on screen to be given if a grenade falls either on the tile or an adjacent tile to the thrower and providing that the place where the grenade landed is not within 2 tiles of the original target square. "SGT Smit has butterfingers." "CPL Chris has fumbled the grenade" etc.

Grenades in my opinion have felt so useless specially compared to the old xcom, The throw range on the grenades are good but the damage and area damage so useless to use. When I have a choice of throwing a grenade I have to get so close to throw it because the area damage is so small. Then once you risk the lives of your men throwing that grenade it hardly takes him down, you need to throw at least 2-3. Then once I upgrade towards the new ones it still has the lacking area and damage unlike the old xcom grenades that just blow up football fields and drop any monster in its path.

Hello all! First i would like to say that the game is very good so far! i'm impressed with the work of such a small team of developers. it tottally maintains the spirit of the original and it's better than the new xcom in many things. One of things is the music, it is amazing, and for me its one of the more important aspects of a game and its difficult to see games with good music. Well here goes my suggestions: 1. I find difficult to use grenades, they have a short range and very small blast radius. 2. There should be more explosive ammunitions, its fun! 3. the improving of stats could be different. I also get improved tu's or accuracy and nothing else. I think there could be other factors to improve strengh and bravery. 4. im only in begging of game, but i don't like how we breach the small ufo. The flashbangs don't stop the aliens from shooting in next turn, they are weak, i always find better to shoot them, so the flashbangs become irrelevant. Sometimes there are 3 aliens inside and there is no way to not get shot at. Maybe there is some tactic i haven't figured out. also many times it seems weird that so many aliens com from that small ship... its like they are stuffed in there. Also i find kind of easy sometimes to guess where they can be, maybe the spawn points could be improved or more varied. 5. I know some maps are still to improve, but some have no cover at all, specially desert maps. And i almost don't get city maps. but maybe that's beggining. congratulations!

So i watched a few Let's Plays of the new Xenonauts builds recently and they got me back into the game. What i noticed was that nearly everyone thought that shields and grenades were pretty useless. I then tried them in my game. And... Man They're Amazing! Expecially the Shield/Grenades Combo is fantastic. I can't tell you how many times this made an otherwise unwinnable battle into a piece of cake. I usually have 2 Snipers, 4 riflemen, and 2 assaults with pistol and shield combo combined with a shotgun and stunrod in the backpack to storm ships and in case the enemy gets too close up. And it works beautifully. Every time the enemy gets all hunkered up, with few cover for me to use i just get an assault with shield and a riflemen hiding behind him, slowly creeping towards the enemy. Since the Shield is absolutly amazing, my soldiers nearly get no damage this way and once they are in range, i just throw grenades at the enemy and they're toast. At least i didn't encounter an enemy that can withstand two alenium grenades yet. So: What's your opinion on grenades and shields?

Hi, I normally start my games by using grenades instead of firearms to get past the early difficulty in the game. Everytime I do a mission in night it changes my default granade to a flashbang (even though I carry none with me). This is very frustrating to me, can you please make it so I can drag and drop my standard grenade when I'm in a mission (from backpack/belt/hand).

So after remembering that I can actually throw a baseball more than about 15 feet I'm not happy with it. I should not have to run up to a guy so he can shoot me for two full turns before I can throw a grenade at him.

So far in everyone's opinion, what is the best version so far where grenades are balanced? I'm on the latest version Steam gives you by default (18?) and so far I've experienced the following: Grenade fumbles: Fumbles can happen but these guys are listed as special forces with combat experience--the best of the best yet these guys are more of a threat to themselves than the aliens are. Its not unusual for my soldiers to flash bang or gas themselves at minimum of 1-3 times in a fight. Wimpy fragmentation: Lethal radius of a M67 for example is around 5 meters and reaches out to about 15 meters. The lethal blast radius is pretty small (but it DOES get your attention). If you can be suppressed by a near miss from an assault rifle, I'd think you'd more than flinch from a grenade detonation. Way too long a range: You *CAN* toss a 500g M67 around 25-30 meters(?) but in this version you can toss clear across the map. Yikes. Not sure what the distances are in the game but I should like 20 squares would be reasonable for a frag and less for smoke or other canister type grenades (shape and size;) as well as weight affects range) Random Cloud: Gas/smoke grenades should produce a radial gas the moves and disperses in the direction of the wind. At the moment you can toss a gas grenade next to an alien and there's a chance the gas won't be in that square. Ideally I'd love it to be able to fling a frag or flashbang grenade into an open window, wait for the detonation then charge into a room while the enemy is stunned or still in cover. You know, one of the primary uses of a grenade.

Is is possible to put a delay on grenade detonation, through modding? I was wondering if it would be possible to have grenades explode at the end of the player's turn, or possibly the end of the alien's. I'd also like to ask if modding the throwing arc and range of grenades is feasible. I and a friend are attempting to mod some features, and we're wondering if there's much hope in editing the grenades.

The way grenades work, is you throw them from cover, shout, "Frag out!" then duck. Currently, this is impossible, since grenades explode as soon as they land. I would like to ask to make it so that grenades don't explode immediately--or at least, that it can be modded so they do not.

hi guys i have noticed that the stunning granades & missiles are really too weak..it's absolutely needed to enhance them(not as the v 18 stable here was too strong but a half way....)with some aliens they are really pointless (i have thrown 15 stun granades to a sebillian guard and he laughed in my soldier face

So, we all love that we can throw grenades over stuff now. Love it, beautiful, thank you all. That being said, I've heard that we now can't throw grenades indoors, because of the ceiling being too low. (At least, one tile high ceilings. I dunno about 2 tiles and up). This got me thinking, and someone else (I forget who, sorry) asked about something similar, and the idea evolved in my head to put two "throwing methods" in for grenades. So, basically, we have the old "straight line" equation for grenades still, and we have the new "high arc" equation for grenades. Why not give us the ability to right-click (or use the scroll wheel, either/or/both), as if we were changing aim levels, to pick which method to use? This way, we could throw over a prop, or we could throw in a straight line under a ceiling. I'd even make the straight line throw have a longer range, if possible, since there's more velocity in the x direction vs the y direction compared to the arc throw, which would have more velocity (compared to the straight line) in the y direction. Does that make sense?

So the shown probability of a hit (or land in the same tile, which I believe is equivalent for damage purposes) seems way under the hit rate I'm getting. The lack of a path line also seems to get me in a lot of trouble with the grenades hitting cover and doing friendly fire (corners are the worst)

Throwing a grenade over a box planter that my guy is standing next to is a bit like russian roulette. Are there plans to fix grenade arcs? It seems like this is a similar problem in games like JA. I recall that UFO Afterlight had a fairly good grenade system, but it's been a while.

Hey! Can't seem to find any info on the electroshock grenade and if it is just an upgraded stun grenade or if it serves an entirely different purpose. Just tried to subdue a Ceasan Officer using 5 electroshock grenades and a stun baton on a Terror mission to no avail. Getting the feeling the stun baton and the electroshock grenades are utterly useless.

The current implementation for throwing is unsatisfactory. The main issue I think right now is that the trajectory path is too unpredictable. I haven't done any actual testing, but based on two recent mission where I would attempt to throw flares, grenades, or smoke over cover and the thrown object would simply bounce off the cover and land at my throwers feet. Or worse, the thrown object would bounce off another soldier and land in the middle of my formation. I believe that there are two possible solutions: 1) Change the probabilities of a thrown object hitting something in flight. It appears that the lower the chance to hit, the higher the likelihood that an object in path will be hit. That might be just player math at work, but it does appear that way. Perhaps change the math so that the chance to hit the object is the chance to miss. (ie, if you have 93% chance to hit the hale bay one square away, if you are throwing 20 squares away there is only a 7% chance to hit the bale of hay) Or Use a scatter table. First, roll to hit. On a miss, roll against the table for the result. Hitting an interfering object should be modified by the throwing skill of the thrower. Results would be distance and direction, hitting but causing no damage/effect (ie failed item) hitting an object and bouncing in a direction/distane proportional to angle of incidence, and a critical failure like a drop. 2) Improve the UI. I'd suggest either showing the chance to hit an object that is in the path of the thrown item or a grid overlay showing the potential landing areas of the thrown item. Green colored grids for high likely hood landings, yellow for low likelihood landings, and red for blocked throws possibilities.

I am very shocked at how utterly useless are the first grenades. Even the wooden bench doesn't get destroyed by the Alienium grenade. Shouldn't grenades be good for flushing out aliens out of cover? I have thrown two Alienium grenades next to wooden bench and after 2 explosions the bench didn't break. Also why grenades dropped under the first aliens feet don't kill them? I think they need serious upgrade in destruction power. Not only they cost 40 TU's to throw - the % of hitting is very low and the damage is meh.

Currently as far as I have been able to tell you are unable to throw grenades over ANYTHING you are up against... anyone would be able to do that, ESPECIALLY a trained soldier. Now for an object that is mid arc in the throw I would understand if it hit that and fell there, but for you to everytime throw the grenade right at yourself it's awful. Please make it so your soldiers can throw from behind rocks, etc. Also when you want to throw a grenade over a fence or something you are against would be great.

Grenates do not override any obstacle it is a bug? it is annoying to treat a soldier click at least 5 times per soldier, perhaps it would be better with a click removing most TU

1. Does smoke do anything yet? I was playing on the latest build today and my soldier was able to spot an alien at the edge of his sight range after TWO of his squad mates threw smoke grenades in front of him to conceal his advance. Perhaps it was lowering my hit percentage (I think it was), although I didn't see any little percentage indicators along the line of fire to indicate that this was the case. Regardless, I should not have been able to see an alien at that distance through that much smoke, at least by XCOM physics. 2. Can smoke clouds persist longer? Maybe the cloud could persist at maximum diameter for an extra turn before dispersal. 3. Can we have smoke rockets? 4. Are aliens ever going to use smoke grenades to conceal their positions? I get the feeling that the development team really doesn't appreciate the importance of smoke grenades. The very best players of UFO2000 (the one-on-one online XCOM remake that was faithful to the original game) would chuck 2 or 3, even 4 smoke grenades EACH TURN at the opening of the game so that their scouts could get flanking positions and spot for the snipers in the backfield. After two turns, half of the battlefield would be encompassed by smoke. The excessive use of smoke grenades in UFO2000 was partially based on the "scout and snipe" method that worked well in XCom, which may not be so effective in Xenonauts, but in both games it is useful to provide instant concealment in the open field. For example, aliens should automatically throw smoke grenades through the ship doors before they bust out. If they decide they need to retreat (which they seem to do a lot in this game), they should throw a smoke grenade in between their retreat path and the incoming fire paths. 5. A common rebuttal against increased sight ranges is that it would ruin the "tactical nature" of the game if soldiers could shoot all the way across the map, but I disagree. Rather, the use of smoke grenades, especially on the flat arctic maps, adds an extra degree of strategy, for players are required to generate their own concealment to advance through open fields, tundra, and deserts.

I finished the stun weapon research, but unless I missed something (are they in the workshop instead?), all I can find is the stun baton, not the grenades.

When you prepare to throw a grenade and moving cursor from tile with alien, grenade aiming mode switch off. In [v18] trouble still presents. Why I think it is a trouble& Imagine a situation: 9 aliens standing as a 3*3 square group You want drop a grenade at central alien (to hit all 9 bastards at once) - and it's totally impossible! Of course, situation with 9 aliens is my fantasy, but it is still annoying when alien on a cursor's way (not grenade's way! No influence on %% to-hit!) impede grenade aiming. Possible use-case is when you deciding which alien of two you have better chances to hit: - Click on UI grenade icon, aim first alien, see percents - move cursor (lost grenade mode) - Click on UI grenade icon second time, aim second alien, see percents - first alien was better! - move cursor (lost grenade mode) - Click on UI grenade icon third time, refraining yourself from indecent words - and only then click to throw. To me, it's not how it must be What do I suggest: grenade aiming mode must switch on and off just like non-alien shot mode. You click grenade icon, it became highlighted and highlighted until: a) you throw a grenade or b) you click grenade icon again or c) you switch to another soldier, end-of-turn, inventory mode etc. In other words, grenade aiming mode switching off only after click or keyboard command, but NOT as a result of mouse moving.

From my experiments in the field, suppression for grenades is worked out in exactly the same manner as it is for guns, which is a problem. It makes weapons like flashbangs pointless because once a grenade is either thrown or scatters outside it's operational range of 10 squares the amount of suppression a flashbang then does drops off very quickly. It is far better to use a weapon like the machinegun which admittedly costs 12 more TUs to use but has a much longer range and is consequently more reliable when causing suppression Could suppression for grenades and rockets be worked out from point-of-impact rather originating point please? And if the same modifier for range also applies for other types of damage other than suppression, could those also be applied for point-of-impact rather than originating point as well?

Can we have some? Please Or are they in the game already?

When breaching a room or ufo held by aliens, it would be nice to be able to toss a grenade in through a window or open door without having to stand in front of it. To have a solider to the left or right of the door throw a grenade around a corner. Right now you can really only throw one straight in. I guess there is the possibility that being able to toss a grenade around a corner would be too powerful and not in the sprite of putting your units in harms way. However, since it is being tossed around the corner the accuracy can be lowered. When I first started playing, I didn't really use grenades at all. Now I have been making a effort to use them more. Breaching a room where you know (or believe you know) contains aliens always stands out as a time for grenades, but I always find it hard to get the grenades in. The balance could be a problem, but I think the idea is good enough for some discussion

A simple suggestion to improve the way we see Xenonaut soldiers throwing grenades. Right now it's very hard to predict where a grenade will land, so I suggest introducing a marker similar to the one in Jagged Alliance 2. There we had two "cursors" - one was showing the target tile you were trying to hit, while the other (it was red cross) was showing a place where your grenade would most likely land. Please look at this example, it shows a grey cursor that indicates the zone I want to hit and in the meantime red cross is telling me a that grenade cannot reach it due to obstacle in the way. If that feature is already planned please do not throw grenades at me.