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Reduce radius of suppression for friendlies to 1/2 of normal.


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The way suppression was implemented in the game you should only suffer suppression if you are close to the point that is under attack, not if you happen to be somewhere along the line of fire.

I am not convinced that system is working as it was supposed to though as people are reporting suppressed soldiers who are not in that danger zone.

If it was working in the way it was originally supposed to be implemented then I don't think the concerns would be raised as much.

You would have to be standing practically on top of the alien that was under attack in order to suffer suppression.

Even the machine guns only have a suppression radius of 3 tiles so any friendly outside of that radius should be fine.

If the suggested 50% reduction was implemented then you would have to stand within 1 or 2 tiles instead of within 3 to be suppressed.

If the system is working according to the original design then you should be able to fire on any enemy who is more than 4 tiles away from a friendly with any weapon in the game, including the rocket launcher or C4, and have your troops be safe from suppression.

Has the system been changed since the initial implementation or is it not working as intended?

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No idea. If it was working as intended I'd probably have less problem with it. BTW, if a machinegunner opens up on someone that is 3 tiles away can he suppress himself? I've never tried that.

I still think you should be suppressed as much as an alien unless you standing close to the target zone. Even if the system were working perfectly right now (and maybe it is) I'd still want the friendly zone to be smaller.

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Has the system been changed since the initial implementation or is it not working as intended?

For what it's worth, I'm almost entirely certain that I've seen suppression happen such that bullet impacts must be being used rather than simply the intended target.

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I vaguely remember Chris saying something about the person firing the shot being immune to the suppression.

I don't know if that was implemented but it makes too much sense to have been missed out.

Never happened to me even if I open the UFo with LMG guy and there is alien just next tile.

Here is another example of strange suppression - soldier behind UFO wall, though this time closer to an alien being shot at. He is behind a wall so in theory he is safe from any bullet.

xenonauts 2014-04-14 20-06-21-80.jpg

xenonauts 2014-04-14 20-06-21-80.jpg

577e7cd758464_xenonauts2014-04-1420-06-2

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For what it's worth, I'm almost entirely certain that I've seen suppression happen such that bullet impacts must be being used rather than simply the intended target.

That is one of the things I argued for when the suppression system was first proposed but it was not implemented in that way.

If it has not been changed then it might be broken.

Only one of the dev team can answer that question really and until they do I don't think we can really come up with any fixes for the undesirable behaviour.

If bullet impacts or bullet path are tracked for suppression then maybe reducing the effect of suppression on friendlies needs to be looked at.

If the current system has a bug that is suppressing targets who should actually be safe then fixing that bug could solve all of the issues at once.

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Here is another example of strange suppression - soldier behind UFO wall, though this time closer to an alien being shot at. He is behind a wall so in theory he is safe from any bullet.

Yea, and its also possible to gas or bomb aliens inside without even opening the door. Though I'm guessing that currently the crash issues are the priority before release than to add any new elaborate calculation scheme.

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Stopping chance for objects already helps decide who can be aimed at or hurt by projectiles.

If the same could be done for explosions or gas so that the chance of a cloud appearing or suppression being applied on the other side of an object was related to the stopping chance of that object then 100% walls would block gas and suppression.

It might be nice if anything below 100% was ignored for gas but it could give a cover save against suppression.

I don't think any calculation is performed in that way for area effect damage and I have no idea how difficult or time consuming adding it could be.

It might also not be an issue for suppression if the calculation is bugged.

The fix might remove the problem.

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That is one of the things I argued for when the suppression system was first proposed but it was not implemented in that way.

If it has not been changed then it might be broken.

Only one of the dev team can answer that question really and until they do I don't think we can really come up with any fixes for the undesirable behaviour.

If bullet impacts or bullet path are tracked for suppression then maybe reducing the effect of suppression on friendlies needs to be looked at.

If the current system has a bug that is suppressing targets who should actually be safe then fixing that bug could solve all of the issues at once.

To follow up on this, I did a quick test and what I wrote above appears to be true: suppression is centred on impact-tiles, not the target.

Here is the shot I was testing:

2014-04-15_00001.jpg

Bullet hits the target:

2014-04-15_00002.jpg

Bullet hits the wall near the other soldier:

2014-04-15_00003.jpg

Obviously, this is testing using friendly fire and not against hostile targets. But I'm not sure why the calculation would work differently between then, and I'm almost entirely sure I've seen this occur with alien units in the past as well.

2014-04-15_00001.jpg

2014-04-15_00002.jpg

2014-04-15_00003.jpg

2014-04-15_00001.jpg.505dce73e2edfe2ef40

2014-04-15_00002.jpg.f79647205be1ec33e81

2014-04-15_00003.jpg.9443ac75ee7b1094a05

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To follow up on this, I did a quick test and what I wrote above appears to be true: suppression is centred on impact-tiles, not the target.

Here is the shot I was testing:

[ATTACH=CONFIG]3336[/ATTACH]

Bullet hits the target:

[ATTACH=CONFIG]3337[/ATTACH]

Bullet hits the wall near the other soldier:

[ATTACH=CONFIG]3338[/ATTACH]

Obviously, this is testing using friendly fire and not against hostile targets. But I'm not sure why the calculation would work differently between then, and I'm almost entirely sure I've seen this occur with alien units in the past as well.

That's good to know. Although, that poses two questions:

1. If it does work on the impact tile is the radius fully around each impact tile? For example: If suppression radius of the weapon is one tile and the shots land in three different tiles (A, B, C) is the effective suppression area actually Ar + Br + Cr? If this is true you'd up with a much larger suppression radius than what you expect. It would look a like a group of circular lobes that overlay each other.

2. Is the full suppression value applied to each target in the impact tiles? If so, the number of rounds hitting the target tile is immaterial to the effectiveness of the weapons suppression abilites. That seems counter-intuitive to me as the reason a machinegun is so suppressive is that a lot of bullets impact in a small area in very short amount of time. If that were not the case than single shot weapons should be just as suppressive. If the suppressive is evaluated on a per bullet basis instead of for the whole burst than everything is OK. For example: A 10 round burst from an LMG with a suppression of 40. Is that calculated as 10 chances of 4 suppression applied to the respective target tiles OR is it 40 in every tile a bullet lands in plus the suppression radius around it?? That would seem wrong to me.

Chris or Aaron, can you provide any clarification? Is this a bug report possibly?

Edited by StellarRat
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