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Mod Request - Helicopter Air Support


HoboRed

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I would like to propose an idea for an Air Support Mod.

I can only do basic editing, so I am just starting a thread to gather ideas.

Air Support could be achieved by using the appearance of bullets/rockets firing down from the sky above the alien.

Is there a way to make bullets manifest from any selected tile (preferably the highest) during a given instance?

We don't need to see the actual helicopters. Just hear the sounds. It could be an AH-6 Littlebird (Which occupies 1 base square) or an Apache (occupies 2 base squares). Select a target and the firing comes from the highest tiles above target, and a little to the side. to make it appear like the bullets are coming from the sky.

You get 2 Gun Runs per Ground Combat. If it's an AH-6....you get 1 mini-guns and 1 rocket. Apache gives you 1 rocket and 1 precision 30mm chain gun burst. If the alien is inside a building, the bullets and rockets hit the top of the building.

Only 1 helicopter per mission, besides the Chinook. They fly the same speed as Chinook. Fighter escorts are still necessary or risk losing 2 helicopters.

Not sure if the AH-64 was around during the Cold War, but the Loach and Cobra were in Vietnam and the Hind was available in Cold War days.

EDIT#1

Add extra aliens to keep the game balanced.

The purpose for this Air Support is for "Oh Crap" situations. Like when you see an alien but everyone is out of TU's.

EDIT#2.

- EXAMPLE Sound clip for AH-6 helicopter:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Nef0iFafRw

EXAMPLE for AH-1 Cobra helicopter.

Edited by HoboRed
Sound clips for helicopter support
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I would like to propose an idea for an Air Support Mod.

I can only do basic editing, so I am just starting a thread to gather ideas.

Air Support could be achieved by using the appearance of bullets/rockets firing down from the sky above the alien.

Is there a way to make bullets manifest from the highest tiles during a given instance?

We don't need to see the actual helicopters. Just hear the sounds. It could be an AH-6 Littlebird (Which occupies 1 base square) or an Apache (occupies 2 base squares). Select a target and the firing comes from the highest tiles above and away from him.

You get 2 Gun Runs per Ground Combat. If it's an AH-6....you get 1 mini-guns and 1 rocket. Apache gives you 1 rocket and 1 precision 30mm chain gun burst. If the alien is inside a building, the bullets and rockets hit the top of the building.

Only 1 helicopter per mission, besides the Chinook. They fly the same speed as Chinook. Fighter escorts are still necessary or risk losing 2 helicopters.

Not sure if the AH-64 was around during the Cold War, but the Loach and Cobra were in Vietnam and the Hind was available in Cold War days.

Waay too OP. 5-10 aliens couldn't hope to stand up against a chopper.

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The way the game currently works when you fire a weapon a projectile is generated that moves to the target location then deals damage to whatever is at that location.

As far as I can tell there is no way to generate damage from another location as would be required for your suggested approach.

A similar approach was suggested for artillery support a while back.

The rockets and helicopter gun rounds would need to move from an existing trooper to a target in their line of sight in the same way a rocket launcher round does now as far as I can tell.

There may be other weapons or abilities that are not currently active that could change that though once they are fully implemented.

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Would it be possible to trick the game to think a shot was fired from a specific tile when the "Gun Run" is selected?

Like trick the game to think someone has just shot down from a 3rd story window?

Add an "Invisible Hidden Soldier" which becomes the "Helicopter" in the sky during the mission. That soldier stays in the center of the sky and cannot be shot (or maybe it can?) and that provides the shooting downward effect, with a modified damage/weapon?

Edited by HoboRed
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I actually started a similar thread covering air craft formations and possible use for air to ground

If we let the aliens also do gun runs then its not OP

its maintaining Air Superiority

AIR COMBAT FORMATIONS

HOBO, interesting idea, let me run a tweak to your idea past Gaud

GAUDDLIKE,

is it not possible to spawn "floating weapons" that have no sprite that fire?

or would invis soldiers that fire on targets you mark be easier?

In both cases you would just spawn alien guns, rockets, and machine guns (or aliens and soldier who have no sprites and don't share LOS with ground troops, and have 0 reaction fire) at game start and these "air assets" can then be used.

They would move around the map unknown to the player, and when you mark targets they take a shot from where they are and move towards the marked area

They repeat this for 3 turns (little birds) (total 4 turns of fire)

or 1 turn (jets/alien fighters) with them shooting the same area (total 2 turns of fire)

Aliens should send down air support after 1-20 turns (random)

And your air assets are only their if you bring them

Whatcha think?

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As far as I know there are no such functions in the game and modders wouldn't be able to add them (modders can tweak functions but not add entire functions). Goldhawk would need to add them or something very similar to the core code first.

I have no idea how willing they are to do this.

I think the idea sounds more "cool" than "fun".

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If the aliens have air support as well they should be required to have craft available nearby on the geoscape.

I don't know how to make that work, having so many craft being accounted for on the geoscape side.

If the aliens were smart enough to use air support they wouldn't even bother fighting soldiers on land, they could just glass the area.

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Hello,

But tacobandit, per Cholloriem, only one missle, and one cannon. cant reload. thus cant really glass the area.

favor that idea. at least can hold back reserve in case for a cussing commander...

R

edit: {face palms} not cholloriem, Hobored

Edited by rynait
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You could add vehicles that had no sprites and so were invisible to the player.

I say vehicles because you can set their stats unlike soldiers which are slightly random.

You cannot define a spawn for them other than the default ones your normal troops use.

They would also need to be added to the dropship as per any other vehicle or they would not spawn.

Just because they were not visible to the player doesn't mean that the aliens would not react to them.

They would also appear on your UI and be usable as any other vehicle/trooper.

You also would not be able to specify any differences, like not providing or sharing LOS.

Basically you need to look at what is currently in game and how those assets can be used.

Without access to the source and a skilled coder you cannot add anything on top of that.

It doesn't appear that anything in the game can move vertically (at least without standing on solid ground) so adding a small flying vehicle (to represent a UAV or similar), visible or otherwise, to fly around and provide air support would also not appear possible.

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He's right. It would not be possible without modifying the game's source file or creating an add-on. It would not even be logical to even attempt something like this until the final version of the game is released, and even still after patching the final version.

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when you say "support" do you really mean "used as bait"? :)

No, support as in support :)

It is from "AllianceX", where "Little Bird" is used in mission 1 "Baptisms of fire", as a support/transport vehicle (it might change color before final version) and there isn't expected to be any alien aircraft in the area. It will be more a support for ground forces.

The "Little Bird" is used because the Apache helicopter is out on another mission, but even if it was available, the Apache can not be used for transport (2 people in Apache, 4 people in "Little Bird").

litlebird.jpg

apache.jpg

litlebird.jpg

apache.jpg

litlebird.thumb.jpg.b337dad839b5e463b36d

apache.thumb.jpg.2fa8735a8e6acbb246fe56a

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I got a little Apocalypse vibe seeing the variety of transport options there, Oracle1990.

As for the OP on helicopters, I agree that the aliens would need a counter measure for game balance. However, due to the large number of alien escorts and there being 3000 of them in orbit, I think it makes sense for the countermeasure to be support UFO.

I can't imagine it's much fun to watch your carefully positioned troops being mown down by a strafing support Fighter. That's been my feeling when this, and other support weapons have come up before. If they were to be added, you should face superior equivalents from your opponents.

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Your right and I don't think we really need any visual effect for the bullets. Unless a gun is firing tracer's the only thing you see IRL is the impact. Just the sound of an aircraft flying over, a gun firing, followed by dirt getting tore to pieces or an explosion at the chosen target area.

For the alien craft it would be a laser sound and or explosion. Your Xenonauts would have to move from house to house.

The hard part is making the game register the hits in an appropriate area with given dice-roll for accuracy. Air Support would have to be more of a suppression value, with lower accuracy than ground troops.

Edited by HoboRed
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Would there be much of a difference if you just added a weapon that was essentially a "air to ground targeting laser" that had no image for the bullets travel, but had explosions for the impact? Thematically it would appear to function in a similar way to what you want.

I suggested something like that in the artillery support thread.

Add a 'laser designator' weapon that fires an invisible projectile to mimic an off screen strike.

The down sides I couldn't work round:

You would be able to use it indoors, or even underground.

It would require line of sight to the target and would need to travel between the two locations, potentially hitting any object along the path between the two, unlike a strike from another source.

You could carry as many of them as you had available to make multiple strikes possible.

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I suggested something like that in the artillery support thread.

Add a 'laser designator' weapon that fires an invisible projectile to mimic an off screen strike.

The down sides I couldn't work round:

You would be able to use it indoors, or even underground.

It would require line of sight to the target and would need to travel between the two locations, potentially hitting any object along the path between the two, unlike a strike from another source.

You could carry as many of them as you had available to make multiple strikes possible.

Except how would that be any different from a blaster launcher? If the blaster launcher isn't in the game for gameplay reasons, then this will never be added.

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Couple of reasons.

Firstly the blaster launcher uses waypoints to aim the shot at a point on the map you would not be able to reach with a direct shot whereas this would not.

Secondly this is a discussion of a potential mod, not an official feature, so the devs game play decisions have no real influence.

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Couple of reasons.

Firstly the blaster launcher uses waypoints to aim the shot at a point on the map you would not be able to reach with a direct shot whereas this would not.

Secondly this is a discussion of a potential mod, not an official feature, so the devs game play decisions have no real influence.

coo.

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I suggested something like that in the artillery support thread.

Add a 'laser designator' weapon that fires an invisible projectile to mimic an off screen strike.

The down sides I couldn't work round:

You would be able to use it indoors, or even underground.

It would require line of sight to the target and would need to travel between the two locations, potentially hitting any object along the path between the two, unlike a strike from another source.

You could carry as many of them as you had available to make multiple strikes possible.

Yes if you need line of sight then it would basically just be a more accurate Rocket Launcher perhaps with different damage/AoE (which is provided with different ammo anyway). This could be more sensibly implemented with an alien equivalent which does higher damage/is more accurate which I am sure is probably in the game already.

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I suggested something like that in the artillery support thread.

Add a 'laser designator' weapon that fires an invisible projectile to mimic an off screen strike.

The down sides I couldn't work round:

You would be able to use it indoors, or even underground.

It would require line of sight to the target and would need to travel between the two locations, potentially hitting any object along the path between the two, unlike a strike from another source.

You could carry as many of them as you had available to make multiple strikes possible.

I was thinking about some about the unlimited number you could potentially carry and thought of a potential solution. The item could be set up to only be recovered from UFOs. This would limit the number of them in the game so that you can't use them all of the time. In game it could be argued that the item is essentially a "thank you" from the country and a promise to help in the future.

As for the in doors part, would it be possible to make it a multiple shot grenade? That would force it to use a parabolic arc which would limit its ability to hit something in doors. However, I do not believe that it is possible to set up a weapon that fires multiple times and uses an arc. Maybe once the flamethrower is implemented it will be possible to use that as the basis for a multiple shot weapon with an arc.

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I don't believe the grenades work with multiple charges, although I haven't messed about with them for a while and that may no longer be the case.

If the flamethrower is implemented in the way Chris suggested it might then it also will not use an arc.

It will be a template weapon that damages (and ignites) anything along its fire path and in an area around its impact point.

That path would still be from firer to target as well rather than simulating fire from an alternative source.

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